Are We being to TOO critical on this forum?
#17
Posted 19 April 2004 - 02:17 PM
QUOTE
No, I never wanted to see another SW movie. Honest. I'm of the belief that you don't do prologues for things that already exist. Too many opportunities to mess up, as we've seen.
Did you read any of the Novels, comics or games, though?
I could think of some good pics for Niobe. Heh. heh
#19
Posted 19 April 2004 - 03:15 PM
QUOTE (Mike Mac from NYU @ Apr 19 2004, 09:31 AM)
I disagree. We ALL wanted to see more Star Wars movies. We were all waiting a good 15 year wait since the last movie in anticipation. We ALL wanted to know the story behind Obi-Wan and Vader.
Yes and no. I know you'll agree that nobody here wanted a prequel at any cost. Nobody here prefers the prequels to his or her own imagination. The prequels will render canon a dumb story, almost certainly involving a big lightsaber duel between Anikin and Oni-Wan, where one or both of them will fall fom a height, maybe into an active volcano. Fot whatever reason, that has been the active myth for nearly twenty years now. Do we really need Lucas's pre-teen son to write it so we can bitch about it? And do we really need that story out there so now the more interesting story of our own imagination will be supplanted? I certainly don't, and I won't watch it.
Yes, people wanted more STAR WARS movies. Of course we did. But nobody wanted these prequels. Nobody nobody nobody.
"I had a lot of different ideas. At one point, Luke, Leia and Ben were all going to be little people, and we did screen tests to see if we could do that." -George Lucas, in STAR WARS: the Annotated Screenplays (p197).
#20
Posted 19 April 2004 - 04:45 PM
I agree with Civ, when I heard the prequels were coming out, I just said, "Why?" Why prequels? We know what happens, there can be no true drama. If they're good, then yeah, it's cool to see HOW it happens, but we don't need to see that. I, personally, wanted sequels. I wanted something where the fates of the characters weren't decided for me, where the sky would be the limit for techonology and planets and bad guys and storylines. I wanted to be left going into another movie with a sense of "What's going to happen?" not "How's that going to happen?". I wanted to have a sense of wonder. I did not want prequels. That being said, I certainly did not want these prequels so long as they were being made, but I did not want them in general. Sequels were the way to go. I still want Lucas to make sequels, even with the books and games and stuff. And even if they suck, at least we can say the ideas were original.
#22
Posted 19 April 2004 - 10:45 PM
I think Civilian gets to the heart of it when he says "The prequels... render canon a dumb story". That's my big problem with it. My HUGE problem with it.
Think about your excitement when you find out there's going to be a new movie version of a wonderful book that you enjoy, and your disappointment when it comes out comes out and turns out to be a total Hollywood blockbuster that bears the book's name, but little other resemblance (and more often than not involves Gwyneth Paltrow). This is upsetting because it means that there won't be another chance to do the movie "right" for a long time.
But still, you can say "The book is so much better," or "Oh, I'm going by the BOOK, not the terrible movie". In short, the movie is not canon. That's why you don't get upset if you don't like a novelization of a favorite movie, the sequel of Gone With the Wind by a different author, or awful fan-fiction.
For me, it's a terrible blow when something is canon that is not up to the standards you have grown to expect from that particular universe. This is the same creator, the same name is used; there is no chance, as with movie versions of books etc., that a better version may come along in a few years. This is it. The definitive stuff, and it's poop. This is like if, fifteen years later, J. R. R. Tolkein made a sequel to Lord of the Rings entitled "Frodo's Big Day!!!" where Frodo takes a ride in a hot air balloon and then kills Sam for crack money. And is played by Gwyneth Paltrow. That's how betrayed I feel.
Think about your excitement when you find out there's going to be a new movie version of a wonderful book that you enjoy, and your disappointment when it comes out comes out and turns out to be a total Hollywood blockbuster that bears the book's name, but little other resemblance (and more often than not involves Gwyneth Paltrow). This is upsetting because it means that there won't be another chance to do the movie "right" for a long time.
But still, you can say "The book is so much better," or "Oh, I'm going by the BOOK, not the terrible movie". In short, the movie is not canon. That's why you don't get upset if you don't like a novelization of a favorite movie, the sequel of Gone With the Wind by a different author, or awful fan-fiction.
For me, it's a terrible blow when something is canon that is not up to the standards you have grown to expect from that particular universe. This is the same creator, the same name is used; there is no chance, as with movie versions of books etc., that a better version may come along in a few years. This is it. The definitive stuff, and it's poop. This is like if, fifteen years later, J. R. R. Tolkein made a sequel to Lord of the Rings entitled "Frodo's Big Day!!!" where Frodo takes a ride in a hot air balloon and then kills Sam for crack money. And is played by Gwyneth Paltrow. That's how betrayed I feel.
#23
Posted 20 April 2004 - 12:50 AM
QUOTE
Of course we're being overly critical. Why? Because it's fun!
I do not criticise because it's "FUN!" I'm actually a little miserable about the whole thing!! I criticise because I'm pissed off about the lack of quality in these prequels! I'm actually grateful for ChefElf's lists because it makes me laugh and makes me less miserable. So, no, I did not do it because it's the "cool thing" to do. It took awhile before I found the Basher's Sanctuary on theForce.net, or this place, or even find other people who were equally disgusted with the PTs.
No, its not FUN to criticise something you've had a love for many years and become what it is today....
I have only a layman's knowledge of filmmaking, and even I know that something is wrong. If it's that obvious, then something is obviously WRONG!!
Well, enough... must rest now.
Flying Ferret
Battle for the Galaxy--read the "other Star Wars"
All I know is I haven't seen the real prequels yet.
Battle for the Galaxy--read the "other Star Wars"
All I know is I haven't seen the real prequels yet.
#25
Posted 20 April 2004 - 10:34 AM
In the states, there's a tradition that if you don't vote, you don't have the right to criticize the elected official. In my town there's a 3-day downtown music festival that after 16 years, I've never missed a day. do I criticize it? harshly? you bet. I've earned my right.
the star wars movies are the same. This isn't your friday the 13th series, where they throw one together as often as possible. we expect more than the bs we've been served. Lucas was allowed a three year standard when the wonderful ESB was released to a rewarded audience.
But rather than qualify a deadline for release, He didn't understand the bigger picture: "take as long as you need, but dammit- don't disappoint us!"
the star wars movies are the same. This isn't your friday the 13th series, where they throw one together as often as possible. we expect more than the bs we've been served. Lucas was allowed a three year standard when the wonderful ESB was released to a rewarded audience.
But rather than qualify a deadline for release, He didn't understand the bigger picture: "take as long as you need, but dammit- don't disappoint us!"
#26
Posted 20 April 2004 - 08:15 PM
QUOTE (civilian_number_two @ Apr 19 2004, 03:36 AM)
We're not fueling Lucas's mechandising empire.
Hmmm. Let me see...
QUOTE
After all, we're not watching the movies, or buying the DVDs
Check! Well, I'm not paying for watching them.
QUOTE
we certainly didn't run out and buy the soundtack
Check!
QUOTE
or the stupid two-headed toy lightsaber
Check! I still have my original Luke Skywalker lightsaber.
I think I qualify.
Luminous beings are we... not this crude matter.
Yoda
Yoda
#27
Posted 20 April 2004 - 09:00 PM
QUOTE (Laura @ Apr 19 2004, 10:45 PM)
...and your disappointment when it comes out comes out and turns out to be a total Hollywood blockbuster that bears the book's name, but little other resemblance (and more often than not involves Gwyneth Paltrow).
to keep up with consistancy she should be in the third one.
I really hated 'great expectations' with her, she was a total slut who came crawling back after she had someone elses kid. and as fun as it was to watch her get felt up, it still killed the story and romantic side of it all... it was like "you can't have me, but you can touch my-" and moving right along we come that sweet end "well I guess I'm damaged goods now but I guess I can stettle for you."
TOTALLY WEAK!!!!
it was like you said:
QUOTE (Laura @ Apr 19 2004, 10:45 PM)
This is like if, fifteen years later, J. R. R. Tolkein made a sequel to Lord of the Rings entitled "Frodo's Big Day!!!" where Frodo takes a ride in a hot air balloon and then kills Sam for crack money. And is played by Gwyneth Paltrow. That's how betrayed I feel.
see people complain about little differences.
things like american psycho which cut out two of my favorite scenes that were interesting but i agree with the fact that they cut out all the gross over indulgent bits that would make you sick. although the most disturbing part of the book is when he spends a whole chapter talking about the early career of Whitney Houston - I thought i'd need therapy afeter that!!!
but the little things in LOTR make the story move more appropriatley in a movie. and so on...
The thing is, that SW was something like a classic song that you grow up with. something that should not be brought back in some mutated form like that shitty RNB cover of David Bowies 'ashes to ashes' or anything cover by the fugees, or that insanly bad remix of jefferson airplain. it's like seeing your childhood sweetheart all grown up into a crackwhore who does nasty german porn on the side. or having your beloved grandmother exhumed and taxidermed and used as a postmortem monument to body piercing.
it's all just too much :angry:
This post has been edited by barend: 20 April 2004 - 09:02 PM
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#28
Posted 26 April 2004 - 11:40 AM
QUOTE (CowboyCurtis @ Apr 20 2004, 12:50 AM)
QUOTE
Of course we're being overly critical. Why? Because it's fun!
It took awhile before I found the Basher's Sanctuary on theForce.net, or this place, or even find other people who were equally disgusted with the PTs.
What? it exists? how does one get there?
all I saw were SW suck-ups.