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Charlton Heston Dead at 84 1923-2008

#31 User is offline   civilian_number_two Icon

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Posted 12 April 2008 - 09:19 AM

Well, agreed I suppose about how this thread meant to eulogize Charlton Heston the actor and political activist has been subverted by lots of nonsensical generalizations about liberal actors and how they oughtn't to be taken seriously when they talk about politics. But generally I don't agree that when a thread has moved from one topic to another it should be closed, moved, returned to topic, whatever. I figure let it play out.

Anyway Ghello I see your point, though like many you misuse the word "logic." You think Bono oughtn't to be taken seriously when he speaks about the AIDS crisis in Africa. Not because his point has no merit, but because you didn't like his last album (I'll bypass the nonsense about how U2 disappeared from the popular music scene for 20 years and then reemerged with their latest record). This is the danger of musicians and actors speaking about politics, apparently: if you didn't like their last album, thn how could their point of view possibly stand up? I suppose that's why Bob Geldof has been more successful in retaining credibility. He got onto African issues in the 80s and you pretty much never hear anything else from him these days. When he does put a record out, it's no big deal and he doesn't tour them anyway. He's more like an activist who occasionally dabbles in music. Which I imagine is ok? I don't know. It's hard really to get a real grasp of your standards, except that you don't like U2 and therefore Africa is a dumb issue and Bono should get off his high horse about it. And stuff.

Also you like George Clooney but he is a whiner and actors shouldn't get into politics because you hated Charlton Heston and Ronald Reagan.
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#32 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 12 April 2008 - 12:37 PM

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I didn't say I was against them being political, I say it's annoying when celeberities get into politics


Wot?

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Bono is self-absorbed


The fact that you call him self absorbed for spending a bunch of time trying to help starvin ethriopians is a bit ironic.

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He can keep doing it all he wants but celebs who constantly whine about something are the ones I lose interest in.


I don't know that you can consider speaking up about political and social issues to be whining. No one forces you to watch this whining or to read news stories about it. Celebrities have an arguable amount of sway over society, and they can use that for good "we are the world" or evil "we are scientology" Some of them feel they should give something back, so they do. Some of them feel the country could be better so they say how. Just like hpw you and I say it, except there are microphones around.

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Your Bono points debateable, he was famous in the 80s and then he came back outta nowhere with his latest CD


If by that you mean "He was famous in the eighties, did a lot of work in the nineties, then did a song for Mission Impossible, then did an award winning song for Gangs of New York, then did a new album" then yes, yes he did.

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Why should I judge him for what movies he was in?


What are you judging him for then? You said you didnt like a lot of clooney's movies and you dont like Bono's songs, so the assumption is that you don't like their non-artistic endeavors because you already disapprove of their art to begin with.

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I think if it weren't for him doing this he wouldn't be as famous


Please. Charity does not a rockstar make. Otherwise Mother Teresa would have been mobbed by groupies and they'd be selling "M T rocked my face in Calcutta" T shirts. That is an awesome image though.


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#33 User is offline   Ghello Icon

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Posted 12 April 2008 - 07:01 PM

Huh? I don't think I ever said I didn't like his movies, and I was saying his acts of charity definently have made him more famous, im glad he's active in charity and all but it's made him alot more famous, and it seems he always had the cameras on him when doing these acts, but I suppose that could mean anything.

I never said I hate Heston or Clooney. Heston did crazy things and I don't like the NRA, and I thought Reagen was a bad president. I don't see why you guys keep saying I hate Liberals, I think Clooney is pretty cool, but when it comes to politics he's annoying, I can say that about my family and friends though.


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#34 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 12 April 2008 - 08:50 PM

Ah ok I get you now. I dont know that acts of charity make someone more famous, and I definately dont think that that's the motive for them. If I wanted to be more famous I'd hire a publicist, not build an orhpanage in Timbuktu.

As for always having the cameras on him, hes a movie star. Britney Spears makes the front page getting a bleedin hair cut, and any time celebrities get married or have kids or think they might have kids, some reporter digs through their garbage and the pregnancy test strip makes the front page. So I don't see how you can fault any musical or film celebrity for having parparazzi hanging around them. Indeed I don't think they enjoy it as much as you might think.

I got the impression you hated liberals because when you first came in you gave George Clooney, an actor who sometimes does political roles and another liberal actor, and a liberal singer, a hard time but gave Heston, an actor who is president of a national lobbying group, a pass because you liked his movies (thus the implication that you didnt like Clooney's). Now I know I was mistaken, but thats just how it was read.

It seems your problem is not so much with celebrities who become active in political and social causes but with anyone. I guess that's fair, but I have to make the obligatory bla bla democracy only works when everyone is involved freedom=eternal vigilance bla bla speech.

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#35 User is offline   civilian_number_two Icon

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Posted 13 April 2008 - 12:05 AM

QUOTE (Ghello @ Apr 12 2008, 07:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Huh? I don't think I ever said I didn't like his movies, and I was saying his acts of charity definently have made him more famous, im glad he's active in charity and all but it's made him alot more famous, and it seems he always had the cameras on him when doing these acts, but I suppose that could mean anything.

I never said I hate Heston or Clooney. Heston did crazy things and I don't like the NRA, and I thought Reagen was a bad president. I don't see why you guys keep saying I hate Liberals, I think Clooney is pretty cool, but when it comes to politics he's annoying, I can say that about my family and friends though.

I don't know who you're talking about any more. If you are talking about Bone, then basically he hasn't been in any movies. If Clooney, then I doubt you can claim that his charity, about which I never hear anything, is more of a claim to fame than his movies, about which we hear lots of advertising all the time.

Anyway I suppose you're trying to get at some comment about hypocrisy, like how celebrities shouldn't make their politics or their charitable acts known to the public. I may agree with you if it seems that a person is trying to forge a public identity through particular acts, like Lady Diana, but not if a person is merely trying to use the public platform given them by their day job, like these fellows we're talking about. But even then, I don't really agree with you, except in that way that people say "oh yeah, too true" from time to time. I still think charity is rare enough it ought not to be questioned. As for politics, I think that people should be allowed to say what they want about politics without fear of censure, no matter how famous they are. I'm not sure what you mean by saying that Clooney is cool but politically whiny, but you're surprised that people might get the impression that you think Clooney's liberal politics might be annoying. What is it about him that's cool then? It's as confusing as heck.

I don't understand the common perception that famous people should shut up about their beliefs, but it's been around as long as I can remember.

"I had a lot of different ideas. At one point, Luke, Leia and Ben were all going to be little people, and we did screen tests to see if we could do that." -George Lucas, in STAR WARS: the Annotated Screenplays (p197).
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#36 User is offline   Lord Aquaman Icon

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Posted 14 April 2008 - 05:28 PM

QUOTE (civilian_number_two @ Apr 7 2008, 07:11 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Agreed that BEH HUR is a much better film than THE TEN COMMANDMENTS. The latter had 40s glamour girls speaking in the vernacular and it comes across as pretty camp today. BEN HUR was more of an achievement in its day, and it holds up better now. IMO. I think Lord Aquaman secretly felt this himself, when he posted that Ben Hur still.

I just picked the best still of Heston I could find, and that still pretty much summed up what we all loved about him as an actor - the big tough rugged larger than life heroic persona that served him well in so many of his films. Very few of todays actors seem capable playing such a persona as well as he did.

Sure, Ben-Hur's probably the better film featuring a more complex character for Heston to play, but I still have a soft spot for Commandments. Plus, Yvonne De Carlo (Chuck's wife in the film) was hot. I actually started a thread with a poll to debate which was superior - Ben-Hur or Commandments - and took some moderate flack for not including "El Cid".

I wasn't crazy about Heston's politics either (how he went from being a moderate liberal Democrat who supported Civil Rights in the 60s to the ultra conservative Republican boogeyman that the media often made him out to be is a mystery to me), but that doesn't affect my appreciation for his films. Funny, a lot of folk in Hollywood seemed to regard him as one of the nicer guys in the business.

His cameo in Wayne's World 2 as "the good actor" was hilarious, BTW.
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#37 User is offline   Storm Shadow Icon

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Posted 28 May 2008 - 04:36 PM

QUOTE (J m HofMarN @ Apr 12 2008, 01:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Mother Teresa would have been mobbed by groupies and they'd be selling "M T rocked my face in Calcutta" T shirts. That is an awesome image though.


laugh.gif that is an EPIC image. I'm gonna see if I can get a customized shirt of MT chunking up devils horns with those words emblazoned underneath.
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