[DreamerM]

Alrighty, here's a poll for the ages.

So, Tim Buckley! What'da ya think?

• (1) He's a monster stinking up the internet with his artistic swill. Humanity itself is lowered to call him one of our number. Plus he likes little girls, the creepy asshole. Let's kill him. Or, better, let's say bad things about him on the internet! Yeah! That'll show him!
• (2) If only he was willing to listen to criticism, he might be redeemed! But no, there is no hope.
• (3) I don't know who he is but I'll say I hate him just to fit in.
• (4) I don't care about Buckley and I like the comic anyway. Take that, Yahtzee!
• (5) Meh. Whatever.

I answered 5, by the way.

This post has been edited by DreamerM: 26 March 2008 - 03:41 AM

[Man Of Doom]

(2) I guess. I don't really care about Buckley, or know much about him, but CAD rarely manages to be funny.
Actually, make it (5), there are enough good webcomics out there to satisfy me without CAD.

[Patch]

For instance, when Yahtzee points out his dislike for Buckley certain people hop up to happily say that the object of Yahtzee's ire is pure evil incarnate.

That wasn't directed at me was it?

It was the..thing that got me to...check on the games too.

Note: This user was in a semi-conscious state when we typed this down.

Thats no excuse for your dazed style writing!

That's fair enough I suppose; although even against pedophiles disliking someone's work because of the artist and not the work itself is completely bent; even if that's only part of the whole reason.

Disliking a person and their works is completely seperate.

His writing, primarily, along with his games, through which his writing shines. His humor was stifled when he was scrambling for a punchline for every comic instead of being able to work at his own pace

Fair enough. But not all of his writing was brilliant, though most was fine. His games are good, excluding 6DAS (for reasons I care not to explain, right this second).
But yes, some of his comics did struggle, though ones that he didn't frequently update did quite nicely.
Cowboy comics, angular mike.
Ah, good times.

[AdamM]

Wow, I never realised so many people shared the same opinion as Yahtzee about this comic all along! ¬_¬

I've skim-read this thread so excuse me for repeating anything that's been mentioned. I don't read CAD, though I occasionally skip through a few strips. It's a bit weak and I agree it's not Penny Arcade standard, but I can't see anything majorly wrong with it. Yahtzee seems to make a good point about a single strip but it's not ubiquitous. For every horrible, horrible strip (and I agree, there are plenty of horrible, horrible strips) there are about six or seven chucklers, and the character Lucas can be funny. It's not the screaming mess that he seems to think it is.

And as for "too much fucking text", I think the author can draw his strip however the hell he likes. Who is Yahtzee to give him a masterclass in comicitude? For someone who is decrying mediocrity on the Internet it's a bit rich to say "you must conform to making your strip in this particular way".

Anyway, the main thing seems to be getting Yahtzee's goat is that "I think this comic is shite but everyone thinks it is amazing, and they are wrong." And he's accusing Buckley of egocentrism?

[dial]

An analogy to help the people who like CAD understand our side somewhat.

You grew up in a modern society. Certain things in this society are considered unequivocally bad, such as, say, raping children. However, you just recently stumbled upon a quiet little population that supports the rape of children. The children there support it, too, and are somehow totally unharmed by it. Almost everyone you speak to is shocked that you live in a society which thinks child rape is something that could possibly be bad. Every argument you give against it is refuted soundly, and the general consensus is that you should leave if you don't like it.
...but they're raping children, what the fuck!

That's how we feel. You enjoy this comic for some reason, but that reason baffles and mystifies us.

I've skim-read this thread so excuse me for repeating anything that's been mentioned. I don't read CAD, though I occasionally skip through a few strips. It's a bit weak and I agree it's not Penny Arcade standard, but I can't see anything majorly wrong with it. Yahtzee seems to make a good point about a single strip but it's not ubiquitous. For every horrible, horrible strip (and I agree, there are plenty of horrible, horrible strips) there are about six or seven chucklers, and the character Lucas can be funny. It's not the screaming mess that he seems to think it is.

Could you give some specific examples of these chucklers?

[AdamM]

No, because then you will proceed to analyse and deconstruct each strip to explain why it isn't funny and I'm wrong.

[Uszi]

It seems the rape of children, IMO, should have little bearing on the man's sense of humor. I would hesitate to frame an argument in this manner:

1. Buckley is a pervert
2. Being a pervert spoils all of one's efforts
3. Therefore CAD sucks

I would hesitate because it could be used to argue that Pee-wee's Big Adventure is not the greatest movie of all time, by virtue of his smut theatre masturbations. And anyone who discredits Pee-wee is a fool indeed.

I agree that CAD doesn't seem particularly funny, after thumbing through a few comics. But I don't think that being successful and unfunny warrants the kind of criticism leveled at the actual comic. And showing your dick to a 12-year-old doesn't say anything about your comic either.

[joshofalltrades]

Just to throw this out there, pointing to Yahtzee's comic as an example of why he's wrong about CAD is an ad hominem fallacy.

Author A makes a webcomic.
Author B states that Author A's webcomic is mediocre.
Author B has made a mediocre webcomic before.
Therefore, Author A's webcomic can't be mediocre.

Completely off-topic: I hesitate to address the swearing in this forum for fear of being severely lynched, but isn't there a more creative way to express the way you feel? Swearing is sometimes appropriate given certain contexts, but some frequenters of this forum tend to rely on it. A lot. Don't get me wrong, continue to spout your obscenities freely! It's just a little tiresome to me personally to read the words "fuck" and "shit" over and over where there could instead be something like:

Balderdash!
Hogwash!
Tommyrot!
Poppycock!

If you're swearing to be funny, you should know that I don't giggle every time you do. Feel free to find other ways to stand out from the sweating, stinking multitudes.

Post-script: I don't enjoy CAD in the least. I refuse to make a call on Buckley himself. Judge not lest ye be judged.

[dial]

No, because then you will proceed to analyse and deconstruct each strip to explain why it isn't funny and I'm wrong.

I was actually planning on attempting to improve the joke in every example, then telling you why you're wrong.

[Ghello]

Wow, I never realised so many people shared the same opinion as Yahtzee about this comic all along! ¬_¬

I've skim-read this thread so excuse me for repeating anything that's been mentioned. I don't read CAD, though I occasionally skip through a few strips. It's a bit weak and I agree it's not Penny Arcade standard, but I can't see anything majorly wrong with it. Yahtzee seems to make a good point about a single strip but it's not ubiquitous. For every horrible, horrible strip (and I agree, there are plenty of horrible, horrible strips) there are about six or seven chucklers, and the character Lucas can be funny. It's not the screaming mess that he seems to think it is.

And as for "too much fucking text", I think the author can draw his strip however the hell he likes. Who is Yahtzee to give him a masterclass in comicitude? For someone who is decrying mediocrity on the Internet it's a bit rich to say "you must conform to making your strip in this particular way".

Anyway, the main thing seems to be getting Yahtzee's goat is that "I think this comic is shite but everyone thinks it is amazing, and they are wrong." And he's accusing Buckley of egocentrism?

Yahtzee isn't the only person to complain about text, that's everyones main problem with it. If you use the CAD rule that 4chan made it actually makes his comics better.

Even though I hate all of CADs characters and don't care for the story, some of his comics on mocking videogames can be funny. For some reason I can't stop chuckleing at the train gun in the Gears of War 2 mock, and his comic where that guys falls into a forum was pretty funny too. Though, I stated why I don't like Buckley, and the stories that followed after the "Jackie" incident (Where he bans every person who posted on the thread with the dick picture, and then goes on to ban people who were talking about it or heard about it) is enough for me to figure out what type of person he is.

Then again, alot of famous people that everyone likes are assholes.

[Game Over]

I go with

(6)- Tim Buckley has the Nazi police all over his house to protect his ass.

Yahtzee's previous comics don't have much to do with this discussion. They're ancient history.

(though, I feel like I'm ruining my own reputation right now(ignore this if you're not a fag))

Thats no excuse for your dazed style writing!

What did you expect? It was 2:00 am when I typed that down.

This post has been edited by Game Over: 26 March 2008 - 03:31 PM

[bobsickle]

I go with

(6)- Tim Buckley has the Nazi police all over his house to protect his ass.

Yahtzee's previous comics don't have much to do with this discussion. They're ancient history.

(though, I feel like I'm ruining my own reputation right now(ignore this if you're not a fag))



What did you expect? It was 2:00 am when I typed that down.

Wimp! I can still write nonsensical crap at 06:00!

[Game Over]

Ay, forget it. I'm not good in arguing on the Internet.

[Patch]

Anyway, the main thing seems to be getting Yahtzee's goat is that "I think this comic is shite but everyone thinks it is amazing, and they are wrong." And he's accusing Buckley of egocentrism?

I'm fairly sure Yahtzee knows he has an enormous ego, much like myself. Usually, you acknowledge your ego problem, then go, 'oh well, not much I can do about it'.

No, because then you will proceed to analyse and deconstruct each strip to explain why it isn't funny and I'm wrong.

Good point.

Just to throw this out there, pointing to Yahtzee's comic as an example of why he's wrong about CAD is an ad hominem fallacy.

Author A makes a webcomic.
Author B states that Author A's webcomic is mediocre.
Author B has made a mediocre webcomic before.
Therefore, Author A's webcomic can't be mediocre.

I'm not sure what an 'ad hominem fallacy' is. But as I have previously stated, now more then one, I think.
A criminal can change. Let me give you an example.

Author B makes a webcomic.
Author A makes a webcomic.
Author B regrets making the webcomic, and tells author A that his webcomic is mediocre.
How do they know? Experience!

Yahtzee would be one of the best people to know about webcomics. Anyone who has made a mediocre webcomic with a fair fanbase would know what makes the comic mediocre.

[DreamerM]

I'm fairly sure Yahtzee knows he has an enormous ego, much like myself. Usually, you acknowledge your ego problem, then go, 'oh well, not much I can do about it'.

One of the reasons why I made such an irredeemable ass of myself when I actually met Yahtzee face to face was that I, for all my powers of deduction, wasn't sure where his "I hate the world and everything in it especially my stupid fans" persona ended and the real and probably perfectly decent human guy began. Thus, I had no idea about the right way to conduct myself and probably should have just walked the other direction and left the poor guy in peace, except I didn't because I'm one of those complete idiots who'd rather know I'm a creepy asshole rather then wonder if I might be a spineless coward. Gah.

....I'd rather not dwell on that, so I'll just say I don't take the ego at face value. It's that persona that has resulted in thousands of hate-filled responses and low-ratings for GSM on his parody video "Some Punctuation" in which people miss the joke so badly it hurts:

According to Yahtzee's blog, he actually liked that video, but way more people saw the ZP video where he claimed he wanted to burn the guy's house down and so took it upon themselves to flame the guy (a devoted Yahtzee fan if ever there was one) into next week.

you are a fucking idiotic dick-sucking wannabe.

man yahtzee was mad

......Either that or they just wouldn't know a parody born of pure love if one walked up and bit them in the face.

I couldn't even finish watching this dross. Honestly, how far did you think you'd get copying a unique style and technique without all the necessary components, say, talent, and wit, and.. oh I don't know, something relevent and interesting to say beyong 'oh look how fantastic I am copying the exact style and technique of someone so much better than I am. A technique, while useful for flipping burgers, just makes you look like an abosolute TWAT on the internet. Not that it's all that hard to do.

well now after viewing some zero punctuation i saw your piece of shit video in the side bar, the funny thing here being that i was about to comment telling you what a unoriginal cock smoker you are but it seems hundred of thousands of people have already voiced every possible insult i could conjure up to throw at you. The amusing thing here being that Yahtzee has well received and enjoyed job rambling on in his fun accent and your a 12 year old sitting in your moms house trying to sound cooler

wow...............wow.................this is shit.
i cant believe your ripping him off and making fun of his games. its funny when originals you do it and first off dont try and make yourself seem cooler and better just because you dont swear in these videos, it turns out totally lame. And every game has floor and shit and he just made this game in his spare time and you have to be a little bitch about it and put some shit on youtube cause you are a little bitch. Come up with better ideas

Wow. The opening song is incredibly accurate. You are a loser. You failed to get me to laugh even once at your review. And your inability to curse whatsoever left me rather despondent. Oh, and don't tell me you're using your computer to help you parody someone else. It makes your entire presentation very weak.

STOP RIPPING OFF ZERO PUNCTUATION. It's not funny! Congrats for letting everyone on the internet know you're a poser!

"Epic fail for plagiarism. Go die in a fire douchebag."

"Fail video is FAIL.

Step AWAY from your computer and stab yourself in the face. Please.

The above are cut and pasted from the most recent three pages of comments on that video, which was uploaded months ago. The latest comment posted here is six days ago, so apparently flaming the hell out of this guy isn't going out of style nearly as fast as it should have.

It might have been pretend hate played up for laughs when Yahtzee said it, but it's real hate from all of those people and they think they've got official approval to do so, the wayward misguided crusaders. (Yeah I'm never going to be the person to call them out on the jerks they are, I'll leave that to those better qualified to use those words).

The internet is like the Twilight Zone, it's hard to tell what's real and what's not and if you're NOT disoriented yet then you're a stronger human being then I am. Or a psychic.

This post has been edited by DreamerM: 26 March 2008 - 11:36 PM