[Heccubus]

I'm shocked that no one started a topic about this yet.

Shocked.


Anywho, I went to see it tonight, and I've got to say that I was pleasantly surprised. It's a fine return to more adult-oriented fare for Burton, and Depp did an excellent job of portraying Sweeney Todd. The only character I was really uninterested in was Helena Bonham Carter's, and, well...it's mostly because I don't think she's much of an actress. The songs were great, the story was interesting (you really get torn between loving Sweeney as a sort of anti-hero, and hating him as a cowardly murderer and that creates a fairly riveting effect) and the characters were some of the best that Tim Burton has put on the screen in years. I'd highly recommend it, and I am not saying that as a Tim Burton / Johnny Depp fanboy.


At all.



Seriously.

[civilian_number_two]

Taking all the usual risks, I'd like to point out that this was a Sondheim stage show, and that Burton deserves no special credit. After all, it's tested material and all he did was bring it to screen. Depp pulls off a mean caricature, no doubt, but it'd have been nice if he'd tried on a new accent. Apart from the hair, I thought I was watching Jack Sparrow up there. Mrs Lovett, agreed, isn't much of a character, but I don't hold that against HBC, who I think is great in everything she's done.

One interesting difference between the film and the show is how the kid seems to appear like an avenging demon from the sewers. In the stage show he's all white-haired and clearly affected by all he's seen, with the tired cliche that maybe he'll be a killer now yawn yawn. Burton was good to get rid of that and leave it as he did.

Anyway I really liked it.

[Heccubus]

I was aware of the stage show but didn't mention it. I don't think it's any more fair to compare the two than it is to compare, say, the Evil Dead Musical to the original film. Two different mediums, two different sorts of audience, two different interpretations are necessary. Once I realized that EVERY film adaptation of ANYTHING is likely going to fall flat, I stopped holding the different versions to the same standards.

I never once felt like I was watching Jack Sparrow. Jack Sparrow has charisma and a lovable quality that Todd lacked in every facet of his character.

Also, does anyone else feel that Carter is just getting roles in Tim Burton's movies because she's fucking him? Just throwing that out there.

[Slade]

I saw the film and found it entertaining. Depp could have done a little bit of a different accent, aye, and he could have sat around scowling just a little bit less, but I'd recommend it to anyone who would enjoy a musical about a crazy murderer. The songs were catchy, and Alan freakin' Rickman is in it. Also the guy who played Wormtail is in it.

[Despondent]

Not as good as the stage show, imho. They took away the choral parts which added depth to the story. They killed the Anthony/Johanna song and the resulting character development between the two. Lovett was lifeless, Depp was drab. Oh sorry, let me be mindful not to offend. Not a huge voice, let's leave it at that.

I liked the falling bodies though. The Len Cariou/Angela Lansbury version is on itunes btw.

This post has been edited by Despondent: 02 January 2008 - 09:30 AM

[Jen]

Loved it, loved it, loved it. Thought the singing was great, thought the casting was great, even didn't mind that they cut the namesake song, which I'd always loved. Although that being said?

Depp pulls off a mean caricature, no doubt, but it'd have been nice if he'd tried on a new accent. Apart from the hair, I thought I was watching Jack Sparrow up there.

Could not agree more.

JD was great, HBC was great, Sacha Baron C. was pretty great (but not as amazing as all the reviews I'd read prior would have had me believe) and Wormtail guy was super-great. And I loved the super-young Joanna-and-Anthony casting. But I have to say, while i normally cannot get enough Alan Rickman, I didn't think he was nearly as creepy-lecherous as Judge T. as Judge T. should be. But overall? Love love love.

[civilian_number_two]

I was aware of the stage show but didn't mention it. I don't think it's any more fair to compare the two than it is to compare, say, the Evil Dead Musical to the original film. Two different mediums, two different sorts of audience, two different interpretations are necessary. Once I realized that EVERY film adaptation of ANYTHING is likely going to fall flat, I stopped holding the different versions to the same standards.

I never once felt like I was watching Jack Sparrow. Jack Sparrow has charisma and a lovable quality that Todd lacked in every facet of his character.

Also, does anyone else feel that Carter is just getting roles in Tim Burton's movies because she's fucking him? Just throwing that out there.

Yeah, writing music for what had been a horror film and then presenting it on the stage is a different challenge than making a horror film. But taking an opera and filming it on a larger stage than the original opera, but otherwise not changing the words or the representation? Your example is weak. You might have said "I don't think it's fair to compare the two than it is to compare, say, The Phantom of the Opera by Andrew Lloyd Webber with the film version of the same opera." And I'd say yes it is; it's plenty fair. The filmmaker didn't do anything special, apart from bring it to screen, which takes all sorts of talent and tons of work, yes, but not really any "vision." This looks like a Burton film, sure, btu that's because he's been drenched in Goth for decades now. But he didn't invent that look, and it's entirely appropriate for a Victorian horror, so while it works in this film it doesn't seem to me especially "Burton.". As for the idea that any film adaptation of anything will fall flat, I disagree, and could name a few examples.

Jack Sparrow had charisma in the first film, yes, and none in the second or the third. But that wasn't the comment I was making. He used the exact same accent, which is fine if it's your own I guess, but when it's put on to begin with, it draws attention to itself. It's not like I couldn't get over it, but that plus giving him grit between his teeth was unintentionally funny at least in the first scene.

Third bit, no I don't. HBC has had a long career and has been in dozens of movies and television shows. She is the reason for the success and brand-name recongnition of the Merchant-Ivory team, and she stood out in Zeferelli's Hamlet as well as in a starring role in Twelfth Night. I believe that Lisa Marie got appearances (you could hardly call them roles) simply because of her association with Tim Burton, sure, but not HBC. Burton and Bonham-Carter met because he'd cast her already for Planet of the Apes. So he liked her as an actress already; why not continue to work with her? That he didn't give Lisa Marie huge starring roles in his pictures indicates he's not the sort simply to give a part to someone because of a personal relationship; LM got cameos and bit parts. HBC gets roles because she can act.

[Otal Nimrodi]

Well, for one I think Johnny shouldn't have used the Jack Sparrow voice. A different accent would be fine, or even American.

Secondly, it was mostly Sondheim who chose Carter. Although, as I've said before, Lansbury would kick Carter's ass. Carter seemed too... How do you say... Put together? I didn't believe her as someone who would bake people into her pies. I would believe her as someone who would do it if Sweeney asked her to, but not to have the idea.

Other than hearing the Jack Sparrow voice, I thought Depp did a good job with the character. Sacha Baron Cohen was pretty good. Overhyped, but good. I would have liked to hear "The Ballad of Sweeney Todd" and the songs the inmates at the asylum sing. Also the bit at the beginning where the mad old woman does the lewd sex things, I always love that. Does her begging and then she's all "SEX! HAVE SEX WITH ME!

Alms for a pitiful woman? No? SEX!" Gotten across better that she was really insane.

As it was, you had to get the insanity from her part in Johanna 2 about "City on fire!"

Toby was the best I've ever seen him... Judge Turpin was pretty well done. Really he was sort of the same guy as Snape, if you know what I mean. Just played the same. Not quite lecherous enough, but it's good. Overall, pretty good. 'Cept I wasn't sold on Mrs. Lovett.

[Heccubus]

Civ:
1) As I said, there's two totally different audiences. I don't know a single teenager or every-day-sort-of-guy who'd be interested in going to the theatre and watching the stage show. The film had to appeal to a broader audience, so some change was necessary. That's my point. It's the same as any adaptation.

2) Who cares about what his accent was like? If all it takes is something that minute to conjure complaints over an actor's performance, then why not complain about how Viggo Mortenson sounds the same every time he plays an American character. Or Hugh Jackman, Nicole Kidman, the list could go on. It's likely that Depp just found a comfort zone with that accent and decided to stick with it. There's more to acting than the way you affect your speech, and something that minor shouldn't be a cause to criticize someone's otherwise well-done performance.

3) Holy shit everyone, I was joking. Calm down. I'm sure Bonham-Carter is completely and utterly crushed that I made a joke at her expense, but she'll get over it.

This post has been edited by Heccubus: 03 January 2008 - 07:36 AM

[Sailor Abbey]

Also, does anyone else feel that Carter is just getting roles in Tim Burton's movies because she's fucking him? Just throwing that out there.

Can you blame him? I love HBC. Love her!

[Despondent]

I don't know a single teenager or every-day-sort-of-guy who'd be interested in going to the theatre and watching the stage show.

Well, I was a fan of the show at 14, and got to see it 3 years later. But then again, I was introduced to it by my Sister. (ANOTHER teenager). When we saw it, we took a third with us.

I had the score and was working on the Toby song for a choral audition. "Score?" a mate said. "What's the game?" he inquired. Without missing a beat, I replied "Cut-throat".

--

The Ballad was missed, but don't forget all of the other choral bits that help tell the tale. "Sweeney pondered and Sweeney planned..." They're all there on itunes, and most of them are short enough that the 30-second sample covers most of the ground.


Driving away from the film, my bud made the same comment about Carter. Compared it to Brightman in Phantom, he did (my thoughts exactly).

[Heccubus]

Well, I was a fan of the show at 14, and got to see it 3 years later. But then again, I was introduced to it by my Sister. (ANOTHER teenager). When we saw it, we took a third with us.

Okay, but that doesn't make you a teenager now. You didn't exactly come up in the same time. Hell, teenagers at the moment are pretty different from teenagers when I was one, and that was only a few years ago. When I was 16, if someone told me the story then hell yes, I'd probably have gone. I was a horror geek, and probably would've been into the idea. I don't think I could have convinced any of my friends to go with me though.



Well maybe looktothesky

[civilian_number_two]

Hecc,

1. I think we're speaking at cross purposes. Moving on, I like Burton, mostly, and Depp, almost always.

2. I am a bigot. Europeans and Aussies putting on American accents can do as they please because I am used to hearing American accents. So, they aren't disctracting to me. Hearing an American put on a European (or other) accent will draw attention to itself. Depp was careful to affect a (not very authentic) Scottish accent for that Peter Pan thing (and it took some getting used to), but he didn't bother with a different accent for Sweeney. Maybe it's appropriate; he used that low-born Londoner for both, and maybe he figured what the hell. But yes yes yes, that plus the bad teeth had a likely unplanned effect on the oppening number, which was nice apart from that. Anyway, I wasn't criticizing his performance. I was criticizing his accent.

3. No harm done. I knew you were (mostly) kidding. I just thought the question deserved an aswer, especially since that's a criticism actresses get from time to time when they date their costars/directors/producers/what-have-you. Funny enough, I'd just been chatting with a lady at a party about how sexy HBC is, that she managed to have sex appeal even through her ape costume, while the shapely Lisa Marie was more or less invisible as a near-naked human in the same film. So I was bringing some of that to my response as well.

[Despondent]

I suggest to anyone interested; download the Len Cariou version of Pretty Women for a great listen.
There are others too. On the Depp version of Johanna, I can easily imagine the beggar woman singing "City on Fire, News at Eleven.." (also, it's missing Johanna's singing her "Married on Sunday" part. Big deal; Ah Miss was already missed.)

I'm sorry they didn't do the plan with the Ghostly Chorus. Still, I'm glad the movie has brought this story to a greater audience (and by being shorter, they can reach even More people! )

This post has been edited by Despondent: 05 January 2008 - 03:12 PM
Reason for edit:: it's Cariou. Like IOU.

[looktothesky]

Well maybe looktothesky

Hahaha. If I saw it again, I'm totally sitting in the front row. I saw posters downtown saying that it's coming back this month or something, so I might be able to do it!

Haven't seen Sweeney Todd yet. I might see it in a few weeks, but I'm seeing Cloverfield on the Friday it comes out!