[Just your average movie goer]

Someone on another post discussed how the Special Editions were the first warning that the prequels were going to be shit. I'd argue (and so would Civilian, I think) that the first warning was Return of the Jedi but like Mike says, that's our opinion. But I think it's safe to assume that most of us were a bit annoyed by some of the things we saw in the Special Editions...

the worst of these being Greedo shooting at Han from point blank range across a table and missing - one of the best scenes in the movie butchered.

So I thought it'd be interesting to hear other people's thoughts on the Special Editions. What were the things that really pissed you off? What were some things that you thought were improvements? And any other points of interest are most welcome.

I thought I'd start with some of my own feelings about the Special Editions. I actually must confess that I liked a few of the additions. I loved seeing the Mellenium Falcon blast its way out of Docking Bay 94. I loved the new look to the space fight at the end and the fact that we saw the X-Wings launching properly this time. I loved seeing the extended cityscape at Bespin and the new ending to Return of the Jedi. Although, as you all know I hate the openning sequence to Return of the Jedi, I did like the addition of that Bantha herd. That was a nice touch.

But while there were all these nice touch-ups, there were acts of complete butchery as well. Here's a small list of these annoying additions:

1. Greedo shooting first (if anyone thinks this is an improvement, I suggest that
you confine yourself to a padded cell).
2. All the distracting robots and CGI dinosaurs in Mos Eisley. What was George
thinking? When you watched Star Wars, did you ever think "Oh, great movie.
If only a CGI dinosaur would walk in front of the camera while Luke and Ben
talked to the stormtroopers." ? Me neither.
3. The new Threepio voice-over when Artoo's showing where the Tractor Beam
controls are. That is a really poor dub and absolutely pointless.
4. Seeing the wampa monster. I also loved how this new monster was bleach
white, while we're seeing original shots of a monster with off-white, almost
yellow fur.
5. Did anyone notice how Lucas changed the voice that said "The first transport is
away?" from a deep voice to a really small one. What the hell was the point of
that? And then later on, when Luke gets into his X-Wing and Wedge
says "Good luck, Luke, see you at the rendezvous.", you could hear him very
clearly in the original version. After the 'improvements' were made, you could
hardly hear him at all.
6. When Leia and Lando are fighting the stormtroopers at the end, the soundtrack
has been put all out of synch. There's the big dramatic moment when Boba Fett
gets away, and in the original the music had ended at this moment, to provide
the best dramatic effect. In the new one, the music is all over the place.
7. When Luke fell down the giant conductor in the original one, he looked fake.
They'd cut out footage of him and pasted it one and the colour was all wrong. In
the Special Edition, they fixed that and I thought "Nice." But instead of moving
on to the next thing that needed improvement, they decided they'd go one step
further and make Luke scream. And it sounds so freakin' stupid. It doesn't
even sound like Mark Hammil for crying out loud.
8. Darth Vader landing in the Star Destroyer felt like a large rock had been
jammed into the scene. It completely destroyed the momentum and the pace
and in addition to this, it was the same scene from Return of the Jedi, just shot
from a different angle. Yes, that is Moff Jeorojid (or what ever his name is)
waiting for him. Pathetic.
9. The NEW music number in Jabba's palace... with even cheesier looking aliens
and that stupid one that runs out and opens his stupid PUPPET mouth wider than
a whale could. That may be the most fake looking thing I've ever seen,
including things I've seen in the prequels and Ed Wood's [/I]Plan 9 from Outer
Space[I].
10? I feel weird not having 10 but I covered the ones that really irked me. I
could say that the tenth reason was the Lucas didn't edit out the ewoks and
replace them with wookies but the defenders of Return of the Jedi may get
annoyed at me. So, no. It's just nine things that pissed me off. But man, they
REALLY pissed me off.


So what did you guys think of the Special Editions? Does anyone feel the same way about the above things? Does anyone have any of their own to add? ....

WAIT!!! I knew there were 10! It's just come to me. In the Special Edition, when Han is running away from the stormtroopers, they dub this stupid "Close the blast doors!" line over it. No stormtrooper said that in the original and they didn't need to. Those blastdoors were already closing. This is the kind of thing that leads to more unnecessary dialogue, like "It is obvious that this contest cannot be decided by our knowledge with the force but by our skills with a lightsaber." Stupid!

Okay, the post is open to you guys...

[barend]

i thought the worst bit was in ANH speshul edeshun.

when luke and his friend are talking (a restored deleted scene) and someone walks in between them and the camera (a CGI showy figure) to cover up a sloppy cut, and all of a sudden their positions and exp​ressions are completely different!

it shits me to tears! (so to speak)

[Despondent]

Why does he have this sad, pathetic look on his face? Why doesnt he look like a ruthless intergalactic crimelord who is furious with Solo? Instead he looks like someone that Han could have pissed on and spit at and he wouldnt have done shit about it but cry. I thought that was just the worst thing to ever happen to Star Wars.

I recall seeing an NBC Dateline "state of the art" report on how they did this. it was because of Jabba's tail, and Han circled an ACTOR without a tail on the film. Seriously, would anyone who would have noticed "Wait, Han couldn't just circle around Jabba, he's too big" have made a big deal about it? Instead, googly eyed Jabba tells all the world "we're covering a blunder here because we are state of the art. did you notice?" idiots. worst addition ever.

well, I hated Luke's scream also. Reminded me of when I saw some huge baptist Christmas pageant (my boss was in.) when they nailed Christ to the cross, he's crying out in pain. (we'd been told he was silent like a lamb, I believe. kind of ruined it for ME like Chewie's tarzan yell.)


BTW, I read on one site that the SW holiday special is considered canon. in a similar vein, while at the flea market, I saw a used dvd of song of the south for $27. they said bill Cosby owns the film now.

[CowboyCurtis]

Lucas' divorce should've been the first warning. I think it all went downhill after that, but I have to agree that ROTJ has some warning signs in it.

Add to the wampa scene that JW's music is also off-kilter there, extended and muddled! All tension is lost there. We did not need to see that gory-faced wampa. Less is more. And talk about hypocrisy... Lucas edited the scenes of the stormtroopers getting shot... which has NO BLOOD in it, but now let's add a scene where a monster's face is just splattered with the red matter! MORON, COME ON!!

Of course, hate the Greedo-shooting first scene. Lucas should've heard about this BY NOW!!

I like the fact that film looks a little cleaner. I don't like the new Dewbacks. I don't like the CGI trooopers. Give me the big rubber dinosaur--please!! This captured the imagination better than the new image. As a kid, you knew that if you went to the studio, you could touch this thing they put out there in the desert. It's a tactile, real thing! (I wonder if it's still around), while if you went to ILM for the new dewbacks, they'd point at the screen and say, "There it is... Oooooh..."

bogus.

In a way, I like the new X-wing fighters. The attack runs are little more dramatic, but they still look too... I don't know.. unreal... not there. Again, this is a tactile thing, I think. I would love to see those X-wing models. They're real, they exist...

Don't like the added creatures in Mos Eisely. Again, too much CGI, doesn't add anything to the story. The old version was subtle and exotic enough. Again, you could imagine walking around there, breathing in that Tatooine dust. I just can't with this new imagery. It really puts one out of it.

I also don't like the "explosion ring" they ripped off from Star Trek: Undiscovered Country. If they were going to use CGI effectily, why not have huge chunks give way before the big explosion, something a little more like what they did with the Trade Federation ship in TPM? That was one of the first explosions I've liked in a while. Get a little tired of everything going up in one final 'big boom.' The same thing could've been done for the 'Executor' which crashed into DSII in ROTJ.

I know this complaint has been made before, but with all of the 'correcting' SFX, they couldn't give a red glow to Vader's saber in ANH?

ROTJ. I have mixed feelings about the new ending on ROTJ. I'm not entirely fond of the yub-yub song. Not entirely sure what to think of the new age music. Would have preferred something more Williamsesque... Is this guy getting tired of making music? He's got to be hitting retirement here soon. Time to hang the laurels and take it easy, JW...

Preferrably, I would rather have the original trilogy without all of the special additions. Just clean it up, make it crisper, give it back its original color, and we're good to go...

[Just your average movie goer]

Wo... I can't believe I forgot the extra Jabba scene. Thanks for reminding me about that one. It's no small oversight on my part, forgetting to put on the list.

Yeah, he does look very sissy-like in this version. Now, many of you know, I wanted Jabba to be a card playing scoundrel with a strong resemblance to Jack Nicholsan (preferably hanging around in dodgy bars, smoking cigars). But at least the slug in Return of the Jedi was actually there. And your point was so true, Guest. No-one would give a second thought about crossing this guy. Han could have shoved him under the landing ramp of the falcon and lower it down, making a nice green paste on the floor of Docking Bay 94.

The other problem with the scene is that it's pointless - everything they discuss was covered in the conversation with Greedo (in exactly the same words sometimes). Another lame interruption to the movie.

Incidentally, you'll all be pleased to know if you haven't seen it already - that in the new version of Raiders of the Lost Ark, they just touched up the picture and sound quality and THAT WAS IT. And when Indy meets the Arab swordman, Indy still shoots first.

[Just your average movie goer]

I'm hoping that George re-edits it again and allows Greedo to shoot first only to be killed by his own shot ricocheting off the wall.

I would love to see that!

the photoshop-cut-and-paste FX as Han "dodges" Greedos shot.

Yeah, that was pretty special, wasn't it? You could just feel the entire cinema thinking "What the hell just happened?"

Although I don't understand why Han felt he needed to shoot Greedo afterwards. If the guy couldn't hit him from across the table, Han didn't have to kill him. That was just mean!

[barend]

the same way they had that guy walk infront of the camera, has no one else noticed this... ?

no one ever brings it up!!!

[Just your average movie goer]

I know what you're talking about, Barend! I remember it now - but it's not the easiest thing to spot. It's a blink and you'll miss it kind of moment.

You know what I think that is? I think there might have been more talk in that extra scene than what we heard in the movie and I think they covered it up.

You're right - after CGI shadow man walks past, the characters are in different positions. That could well have been Lucas cutting out a couple of minutes of talk that he didn't want us to hear for some reason.

Now why wouldn't you want us to hear that, George? The older pilot didn't mention anything that would contradict your new prequels, did he?

Also, I remembered something else that really irked me about the Special Edition. In the cantina scene in Star Wars, did anyone else notice that Lucas took out the wolfman and replaced him with some stupid CGI critter?

What was wrong with the wolfman, I wonder. Was he too scary for little children?

And if he was too scary, then he should have also taken out Peter Cushing's Grand Moff Tarkin and replaced him with Grand Moff Binks. If you are reading this, Mr Lucas, that was NOT a suggestion. A suggestion would be to put the wolf man back in, take Jabba out and have Han shoot first! When you've done this, get back to us and we'll give you the rest of the list.

[barend]

maybe lukes friend says: "I'm sure glad your here luke, I herd that if you go out into the suns on tatooine you end up turning into a giant blob... they call hutt syndrome, Jabas been diagnosed with it, they rekon it'll take about six years to really do the damage..."
or maybe: "wow this will be just like the clone wars, except we got robots to help us now"
perhaps even:"that Darth Vader thinks he's so tough, oohh, ohhh i'm soooo scared, yeah that death star will survive this attack... yeah when R2 units can fly!!! HA HA HA HA!"

[Supes]

The ending to Return of the Jedi is the worst aspect of the Special Editions. The new music really sucks and I wasn't all that impressed with the extra scenes of the mass celebrations.

Especially on Coruscant, the major Imperial base in the galaxy. Are you telling me that as soon as the word got out, all these systems suddenly rebelled and overthrew their imperial oppressors. Or did the Imps simply lay down their weapons after hearing that their beloved Emporer had been slain.

I mean in terms of time frame alone this is just inconceivable. It had to have been a matter of hours at the most before that Ewok party got underway and that's just not enough time for all of these absurd celebrations to be going on.

Think George! Think! I know this is a Space Opera, but there are some aspects of reality that need to be included in order to allow us to continue our suspension on disbelief.

This post has been edited by Supes: 21 April 2004 - 08:30 PM

[Vwing]

Cowboy, first of all, they technically didn't rip off the explosion from Undiscovered Country because ILM did the effects for it and created the ring in the first place. Second of all, while I agree with you that the Williams music isn't as grand as it should have been, it still is good music, in and of itself. But trust me, he's not getting tired of writing music. Listen to the soundtracks of Episodes I and II, they really are fabulous, in my opinion they are in many ways superior to the soundtracks of the original SW movies.

I think Luke's scream is worse than Greedo shooting first, from a certain point of view. The Greedo scene is just stupid and unrealistic, but we still like Han's character, and it doesn't take too much away from him. The Luke scream in EMPIRE completely ruins any sense of respect we have for Luke at that moment, not to mention the sense of wonder we have as we see him hurtling down with the music playing. Luke had chosen to do that, he was trusting in the Force as he fell, HE WOULD NOT SCREAM! Not to mention that it's a terrible scream! They just remixed the Emperor's scream for it, I believe. Just so unnecessary, and it ruins Luke's character more than the Greedo scene ruined Han's, in my opinion.

[barend]

yeah, the scream makes luke a bit more like anikan in the preqs. (damn preque freque)!!!

as for celebrations on couescaunt, I'm so glad someone else brought this up, that was the biggest thing for me when i saw them at the movies... WTF really. if you lived on that planet during the empires reign, I would dare say you were happy with the system, otherwise it would be like a jew moving to munich in 1940!!! annyone cheering would be shot by the millions of troops, police, patriotic thugs, 50s style diner owners, and so forth...

utter bullshit scene of the century...

[Vwing]

I'm not quite sure how I feel about the ROTJ ending. On the one hand, the music is not Star Wars like at all, and it doesn't give any true emotion, and is unreasonable as you've mentioned. However, on the other hand, it does attempt to show that what the Rebels accomplished truly affected the whole galaxy, and not just 100 ewoks and a bunch of Rebels on Endor. I also did like the touch, though it was a small one, of the Emperor's statue being pulled down. It wasn't great, but I thought its intentions were in the right place, it just could've been done better and more believeably.