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Poor Castro Hope he gets better

#46 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 03 February 2007 - 05:49 AM

It's because they hate our freedom?

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I don't know about you but I have never advocated that homosexuals, for any reason, be cut out of their mother's womb and thrown into a bin.
- Deucaon toes a hard line on gay fetus rights.
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#47 User is offline   Spoon Poetic Icon

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Posted 03 February 2007 - 11:08 AM

...Was that supposed to make sense?
I am writing about Jm in my signature because apparently it's an effective method of ignoring him.
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#48 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 03 February 2007 - 11:19 PM

Spoon- Nope.

Jordan- I guess I may as well respond. Not all communist/socialist countries have people fleeing them in droves. Venezuela is doing well, so is Cuba despite what the US would have you believe. Vietnam dosnt have refugees fleeing it, that was only during the war when the US was systematicly massacring the population.

Admittedly communist countries were poor, but they started out that way. Russia, China, Eastern Europe, etc, they all started out as really poor places where the elite rulers exploited the peasants. Now they're fairly poor places where the elite rulers don't exploit the workers as much. Look at how communist countries were before communism took hold and tell me if they're better or worse off.

Cuba- Battista killed and tortured thousands, and worse yet political gangs wandered the streets killing whoever they liked. The US owned the best part of the arrable land on the island, and around one third of Cuba's poor were unemployed and the rest lived on a dollar a day during the sugar harvest season wehn there was work at all. You can call Cuba a shit hole all you like, but Castro improved the place tremendously. If the US still had its way no one in Cuba would be able to read, people would disappear off the streets and never be seen again, and torture would still be used on anyone the rulers felt like.

And please dont say that's how it is. Castro officially holds 8 political prisoners who have visitations, medical care, and he has forbidden torture since the very first prisoner he captured in the Sierra in 1958 which, by the way, puts him ABOVE the current US administration on respecting human and POW rights.

Russia's labor system was little better than slavery and there was no voting, there were no unions, there were no retirement plans or anything of the sort.

China was an abyss of violence where the government fought the Japanese who fought the nationalists who fought the communists, etc. Peasants had no rights, etc etc.

The point is that any socialist country was not a nice place to live before the revolution that created communism. Admittedly many of them don't go as far as they should and don't stay true to their ideals, but Cuba is one of those which has.

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I don't know about you but I have never advocated that homosexuals, for any reason, be cut out of their mother's womb and thrown into a bin.
- Deucaon toes a hard line on gay fetus rights.
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#49 User is offline   El_Gostro Icon

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Posted 10 February 2007 - 01:35 PM

Aaah I m finally back in this wonderful thread,and got fresh new complaints about the US,mainly the hassle of me forgetting to spam in excellent boards such as this one!

Communism and socialism in general to the average american/influenced youth still automatically bring an image not unlike that of a witch trying to summon a demon performing a ritual in a pentagram:
"It 's not that it s bad,it sounds insane!a(and is probably bad)".
That is until you decide to view everything in an objective view.
It is fascinating how often people miss Aristotle's favoring of kingship/monarchy and even more often his reasonings for it.
The "hardline" communist countries people so often make fun of or sling mud at are really no different.
And I am not on a grauitous "The West" or "The states" bash,just look at the facts.
As J'M mentioned many of those places were deep in the cesspit of things barely imaginable to the average modern and not so modern citizen of nowadays,communism (in spite of my preferance of romantic and suicidical and senseless anarchism) brought those people clothes (yes in Russia people often were barefooted) food and perhaps the most important legacy,education.
This educational level can still be seen among many of the people who were born under the iron curtain's rule that makes most of us look like noveau riche feeble minded bigots.

And no,most persons in those countries weren't very different from us,privately many must have given shit about the glory of the party or the leader,not unlike people who vote A or B just to get it out of the way on the west,granted you were less vocal about it,or eventually you d invoke prosecution.

But then again,let s look at the facts:

-Political enforcement?
The US government bugged phones,kidnapped and arrested people with no viable justification.
Deported many of them back,and many others get covered up to the point they are unrecognizable.
Not very different from political arrests or prisoners in other countries correct?(my father being an anarchist activist got arrested during the first peron presidency so I am at the very least in Argentina quite familiar with it)
-Big brother complex?
Ever heard of microsoft,AT&T,Halliburton and the internet?
"Register,register.If you desire to even look at this product you agree to waive any objection and nod silently if you get a new butt ripped."
"Oh and we will record your conversations and trace your IP adress for quality purposes"
The mustache of our own unexistant big brother is blonde and has the form of an M if you are wondering...
Hell we even have our own opposing movement that exists soley for being stepped on the face by big brother s boot,known sometimes as ecology and others as anti liberalism.
-Economic poverty and unability to raise socially/financially?
Any (now) fellow New Yorker who shares housing can give you a little lecture in how you are never going to make it big and will eventually return to Jersey,succesful or not,for money reasons.
The economic power of the coin really isnt enough,in Argentina as a honest working class citizen(and by this I also mean penpushers) you could barely make it to the end of the month,in the states as a honest working class citizen you barely make it to the end of the month,and whatever may be left after food and transport you ll spend it either in your hobbies or in getting insurance.
Likewise to communism,housing looks like it came off an assembly line and is generally defective or of dubious quality
-Worker s rights and freedom of slavery?
The industrial revolution is back,or it may have never left,yes in communist countries you often overworked (but in better terms than before);but does contemporary capitalism not grinningly aproves of ten and twelve hour shifts? when the ideological maximum used to be eight hours?
Factories work day and night,and it s legitimate workers arent a far shot ahead from their 19th century predecessors who had to sleep inside the factory ,not to mention a good deal of global production is still made by people in a situation of near slavery,now known as sweat labor.

And that is why most people flee said "Shitty countries".
Who doesnt wants to go to that hot place where you can drive a car and wear gold collars?

There is one much more serious and unglamorous reason aside from the proverbial economic poverty,the fall of the political regime in many of these lands also meant the fall of any form of law enforcement,resulting in the rise of rampant crime rates and tribal minded gang/syndicate/party wars where the rule of the strongest is the bread of the day.
Normal middle class people wouldnt want to go a place like Cuba mainly because of the lack of facilities they are used to,cultural habits and the fact that perhaps even Cuba wouldn t like that very much since they are making a nice profit with their current tourism policy


What can we conclude?
That maybe the whole "capitalism vs communism" thing was like antagonizing football(soccer) teams,whose only difference is the shape of their stadium and the color of their shirts?
And yes,leftist systems are flawed at their very core.
Because we often forget that human society is based on vice,and the rule that surfaces from any political system proposition or label is always the same,"[/i]homus lupus hominis" (I'm sure I blatantly miss-spelled that,sorry)

This post has been edited by El_Gostro: 10 February 2007 - 01:39 PM

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#50 User is offline   Renegade Icon

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Posted 22 March 2007 - 07:29 AM

Why would anyone outside a bumm want to live in a socialist country lollllllllllllllllllllllllllllll
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#51 User is offline   Slade Icon

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Posted 22 March 2007 - 09:05 AM

Your "L" key seems to be broken.

Protip: "Bum" is spelled with one "m".
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#52 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 22 March 2007 - 01:40 PM

...I don't know. Ask a Canadian.

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I don't know about you but I have never advocated that homosexuals, for any reason, be cut out of their mother's womb and thrown into a bin.
- Deucaon toes a hard line on gay fetus rights.
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#53 User is offline   civilian_number_two Icon

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Posted 22 March 2007 - 01:49 PM

As a Canadian, I have an answer to that. We like the weaker policing, the freedom to smoke pot, the shorter prison terms. The civil liberties, the illegality of wiretaps, the due process in court. We like the use of tax dollars on things other than the military, without all the usual arguments brought up by laissez-faire capitalists. We like that our retards and our old people can get treatment in hospital without having private insurance. We like our strong social safety net that makes our schools and our inner cities ugly at worst, and certainly not war zones. We like the sparse availability of guns that means my worst worry when confronting a stranger is that he'll beg me for change, not that he'll shoot me for it.

Mostly though, I like the mountains. Vancouver has some kick-ass ski hills.
"I had a lot of different ideas. At one point, Luke, Leia and Ben were all going to be little people, and we did screen tests to see if we could do that." -George Lucas, in STAR WARS: the Annotated Screenplays (p197).
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#54 User is offline   Slade Icon

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Posted 22 March 2007 - 03:48 PM

So all socialist countries have mountains, and everyone lives there to ski. Gotcha.
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#55 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 22 March 2007 - 04:50 PM

Civilian, you weren't supposed to answer. His question specificly stated you had to be "outside a bum" and I distinctly remember you being devoured by a vagrant from Kennebunkport a few weeks back.

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I don't know about you but I have never advocated that homosexuals, for any reason, be cut out of their mother's womb and thrown into a bin.
- Deucaon toes a hard line on gay fetus rights.
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#56 User is offline   civilian_number_two Icon

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Posted 23 March 2007 - 12:32 AM

I got better.
"I had a lot of different ideas. At one point, Luke, Leia and Ben were all going to be little people, and we did screen tests to see if we could do that." -George Lucas, in STAR WARS: the Annotated Screenplays (p197).
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#57 User is offline   Despondent Icon

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Posted 23 March 2007 - 04:47 PM

Your ski hills will be puddles thanks to Capitaliist Bastardz!
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#58 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 23 March 2007 - 11:57 PM

Ski hills... Socialism.... WAIT A SECOND! Those commies that chased James Bond around loved to ski! Therefore we need to send 007 to Canada before they can steal a nuclear weapon and hold the world ransom.

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I don't know about you but I have never advocated that homosexuals, for any reason, be cut out of their mother's womb and thrown into a bin.
- Deucaon toes a hard line on gay fetus rights.
0

#59 User is offline   tempocobnato Icon

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Posted 25 March 2007 - 06:05 PM

To be fair, Communists had lots of nuclear weapons in the Bond films, so why would they need to steal? But then again, they are Communists and Communists tend to be gready.

This post has been edited by tempocobnato: 25 March 2007 - 06:05 PM

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#60 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 27 March 2007 - 11:25 PM

damned gready communists.

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I don't know about you but I have never advocated that homosexuals, for any reason, be cut out of their mother's womb and thrown into a bin.
- Deucaon toes a hard line on gay fetus rights.
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