[Chefelf]

Border Fence Firm Snared for Hiring Illegal Workers
by Scott Horsley

All Things Considered, December 14, 2006

A fence-building company in Southern California agrees to pay nearly $5 million in fines for hiring illegal immigrants. Two executives from the company may also serve jail time. The Golden State Fence Company's work includes some of the border fence between San Diego and Mexico.

After an immigration check in 1999 found undocumented workers on its payroll, Golden State promised to clean house. But when followup checks were made in 2004 and 2005, some of those same illegal workers were still on the job. In fact, U-S Attorney Carol Lam says as many as a third of the company's 750 workers may have been in the country illegally.

Golden State Fence built millions of dollars' worth of fencing around homes, offices, and military bases. Its president and one of its Southern California managers will pay fines totaling $300,000. The government is also recommending jail time for Melvin Kay and Michael McLaughlin, probably about six months.

It is exceptionally rare for those who employ illegal immigrants to face any kind of criminal prosecution, let alone jail time. Earlier this week, for example, immigration raids on six meat-packing plants netted almost 1,300 suspected illegal workers. But no charges were leveled against the company that runs the plants: Swift.

Golden State Fence's attorney, Richard Hirsch, admits his client broke the law. But he says the case proves that construction companies need a guest-worker program.

http://www.npr.org/t...storyId=6626823

This is so beautiful I can't even believe it. I thought for sure it was an Onion headline until I clicked the link.

[Deepsycher]

One day they'll probably be hired to build concentration camps for themselves and it would be their meat in the packing factory.

Now I wonder how much they pay these illegal immigrants in comparison to citizens?

This post has been edited by Deepsycher: 15 December 2006 - 06:03 PM

[Jordan]

This giant wall will be a testament to how stupid mankind has become. Walls won't stop people from finding work.

The mexicans will get money for building it then more money when they dig a hole underneath it and find a better job in new mexico. IT's win-win for them.

This post has been edited by Jordan: 15 December 2006 - 07:04 PM

[Deepsycher]

So this wall could stop people from eating because they have no money to afford food.

Unless of course they ate like animals.

"You can stay in America but you have to declare yourself an animal."

Also I found this AVHRR image of USA and thought at first that it was a sliced open pig with amputated back legs.



No it is not land of the free.
Who said anything about it free when there are walls like this one.

By reading Animal Farm might explain it... Starting from the beginning.

This post has been edited by Deepsycher: 15 December 2006 - 08:21 PM

[Jordan]

Well it's not really the land for all free people. It's just the land for people who already live in it, and they happen to be free.

Here is a better situation to keep mexicans south of the border. If big corporation want money and refuse to stop outsourcing every job to poor countries for shit pay, why not send these manufacturing plants to mexico. Sure, you'll have to build enviromentally safe buildings, air conditioning units, higher wages, and maybe even have a safety inspector walk through once a year, but at least you'd open up jobs for the needy and also stop border hopping. And takening all that into account, you could still pay them less for what you'd pay a North American worker, minus the shipping across seas bit.

The wall is insulting and stupid. My solution is the greatest yet.

This post has been edited by Jordan: 15 December 2006 - 09:09 PM

[Deepsycher]

That sounds like a good solution. I think it could be plans to cut down on pollution. I remember that Bush signed a contract some years ago with a factory or place to make bombs and allow them to generate unlimited pollution.

I think as soon as they move most of the pollution making sectors to poorer countries they'll put up a green flag and say "Hey we're now green."


I was going back to when the land was captured:
When they stole most of the land from the natives and chased them out to the rough areas.
Making slaves out of some of them as well as the slaves they brought across from other countries. And after it became independent from England.

So any animal with coloured skin is our enemy. Any animal with white skin is our comrad. Now I have some more comparing to do.

This post has been edited by Deepsycher: 15 December 2006 - 09:52 PM

[StantheGarbageMan]

You know what they should do? Make Mexico an american state. Think about it- they can't cross the border into America if they're already IN America! They'll just look around Mexico and think "Eh, America ain't so great" and go to South America or something. Make it their problem instead of ours- it's FOOLPROOF.

But still, this whole wall thing is just dumb- did we learn nothing from the Berlin Wall?

[Vesuvius]

You know what they should do? Make Mexico an american state. Think about it- they can't cross the border into America if they're already IN America! They'll just look around Mexico and think "Eh, America ain't so great" and go to South America or something. Make it their problem instead of ours- it's FOOLPROOF.

But still, this whole wall thing is just dumb- did we learn nothing from the Berlin Wall?

Okay, making Mexico a state is not a bad idea at all, problem solved on border hopping, yes. But, that would leave more costal borders for the U.S. to monitor. Think about terrorism here. This could stop immigration easily, but the U.S. would have to come in and set up coastal border cotrol like crazy and at the moment, the U.S. doesn't have the manpower for that kind of manuver. Know why, because their all in frikin' Iraq! A few hundred miles of monitored border between U.S. and Mexico will then be multiplied to a few thousand miles of heavily unmonitored coasts. And terrorist don't care who or what they hit, and making America bigger, will only make it a bigger target, and that's more responsibility that no one is ready to handle.

If the U.S. and Mexico had the determination to work together and form the manpower to accomplish this goal, then I could see Mexico becoming a state.

[Jordan]

Annexing Mexico will not solve the problem. There are things you can't change about society.

1) Many Americans don't want to live with Mexicans
2) Rich assholes want to make excessive wealth
3) Spanish would probably become a second official language, and this would cause major headaches. Look at the French Canadians if you're thinking of pluralism. It's a total failure.

So you have greed, racism, and language disputes. These things are very real and you can't change it. Civilian Number 2 made an interesting point about how gays live in society so we should try work with it cause we're not getting rid of them.

My solution to open up job opportunities south of the border appeals to every one.

1) The rich continue to get rich
2) People who have a prejudice against Mexicans, or people who don't want the 'American' culture to turn into a Ricky martin video, will be happy
3) Mexicans will have jobs and be able to support their families.

Some one will probably say "but Spanish already is a second language" It's not official though. You don't see Spanish on your box of cheerios, tooth past tubes, and car manuals.

You're also forgetting that Mexico will never give up it's sovereignty, the people will not abandon their flag, nobody will swear allegiance to the US flag, and all hell would break lose.

Mexicans don't want to be American they just want jobs.

This post has been edited by Jordan: 16 December 2006 - 04:06 AM

[civilian_number_two]

The "solution" to illegal immigrant workers is to make it illegal to pay illegal immigrants less than the minimum wage. Once there is no advantage to hiring illegal immigrants, Americans will just hire Americans.

I am not a fan of setting up shop outside the country, even though that is the backbone of contemporary capitalism. I woule like to see more local folks making livings from local companies.

[Jordan]

I'm not a fan either and it should be illegal to ship work outside of N.America, but that's never going to happen.

The guys on top have convinced themselves that "today is a different world where a global market exists". THey created it of course. THey break US worker laws in other countries and the majority of people seem to except it like everything else.

It's pathetic but we can't do anything. Not enough people will rally behind local small time businesses. It's something I strive for though. Right now I've easily spend close to 200 dollars extra on all my guitar parts because I buy Canadian/North American made (or at least designed lol) products from some small mom and pop repair/lessons/retail store on Granville (not tom lee).

It's a mad world, just like tears for fears said!

This post has been edited by Jordan: 16 December 2006 - 05:37 AM

[Deepsycher]

Now I thought it was already illegal to pay anyone below the illegal wage but how will that cover a sector of a company moved to another country?
Because pollution laws are weak in countries like China they have even a bigger advantage.


It can be two faced. We are green but not our workers:
We are green.
But how about your workers?
Oh you can forget about them they don't even live here.

Then they'll try to make it Land of the Green if it proves a profitable advantages.


I don't have much personally against illegal immigrants yet. Just against how rich people exploit them to do professional jobs with no professional output. Recently I hear companies are trying to improve the services from China such as product design and customer service but nothing about pollution and pay.


Similar kind of Exploit:

Now for example in a hospital system they can slowly make all the nurses redundant and import LEGAL immigrants to work there with work visas and pay them a little more than their country is paying them but below the legal limit. So they feel grateful anyway that they found work with a little more pay and so they won't question their rights which are dictated by their work visas.

This post has been edited by Deepsycher: 16 December 2006 - 09:47 AM

[Slade]

But still, this whole wall thing is just dumb- did we learn nothing from the Berlin Wall?

Nope, and neither did Israel. It would be nice if the US actually did something to slimeball corporations who employ and abuse illegal immigrants besides shaking its finger at them and then letting them go back to it. But that's a joke.

[J m HofMarN]

Civ, mate, I love you but you're wrong. The problem with illegals working is a lot of it is done for cash out of desperation. They have no unions or laws to protect them, they cant sue, they cant go to the authories. They're slaves basically. Your idea does work but it has to be expanded on. Legalize hiring illegal immigrants and allow them into the country as long as they are willing to work and do not commit criminal acts and can speak enough English. THEN make companies pay them minimum wage. However even then you still have a problem because a guy who turns down a hob for 2 dollars an hour is still going to have that job filled by someone else in an instant.

EVERYONE WHO WANTS TO UNDERSTAND THE IMMIGRATION DEAL SHOULD READ "THE GRAPES OF WRATH" By John Steinbeck.

[Deepsycher]

I read that some are already using slaves legally by putting them through work visas in Europe. Still a little better pay but below the legal limit.