Nirvana Fan boy thread
Posted 15 October 2006 - 04:46 AM
I just watched a slew of interviews with the band on U tube. They were cool guys that understood music.
No rock band has left such a print since them!
Posted 16 October 2006 - 03:09 AM
And don't even get me started on Pearl Jam. Their albums aren't worth the materials they were pressed on to me.
Posted 16 October 2006 - 02:41 PM
With that being said, I feel that this band should still be around, they have every reason to be around, really they do. but they are not. why is this so?, was this not their intent, to reach fame? to become a successful rock band, not only in the short term sense, but in the long term as well? Why did a band that garnered such a mass following end so quickly? Lets explore more into this realm, about Nirvana, about Kurt, about Courtney.Read On if you may.
Do I like the music of Nirvana? Sure, they are a fine alternative band in their own right. I give them respect for having a unique sound.I dig their music, its cool. I dont necessarily hate them, but I dont necessarily love them either. I find myself puzzled at why so many people,... even 12 years after Cobain's death, are still so awed by this band. I mean, I still pop in their CDs every now and then, but I dont have Kurt's stubbly mugshot embellished on every wall in my bedroom,.nor did I ever have for that matter. I think even more highly of the Beatles, Rolling Stones, and Led Zeppelin, doesnt mean I adore them, I just dig their tunes. to so many people abroad, Nirvana meant everything to them.But They are just an alternative band, not some form of lyrical religious cult or sect. Get over it already.
Nirvana has some really great songs. In fact, the only Nirvana song that really gets on my nerves is "Rape Me". Not so much that the title is appalling and shocking, but its also the same title as the chorus, and its a repetitive and redundant chorus at that. Cobain constantly hymns it,.over and over, and over, and over,almost to the point it sounds like."crimson and clover, over and over",.."rape me,.my friend..rape me, again..rape me, my friend, rape me, again". Okay!,.Kurt! enough already..can we now introduce some more intellectual lyrics into the song now?, besides rape me,.or wait,.HE DID introduce OTHER lyrics..but he doesnt sing the other lyrics with the profound clarity like he did with the "rape me" bit. he starts out with saying something that sounds like "i am the only one",.and mutters the rest out where it sounds like "yeeeaa, yeeaa, yeeaa" and sounds like he is trying to chew a double bacon cheeseburger loaded down with peanut butter. perhaps, Kurtie was drugged up on his famous percodans, and whatever other drug he decided to take during the recording sessions at the studio. But even Jim Morrison and Jimmy Hendrix did this, and came off with better sounding albums.
Did Nirvana really possess true musical talent?,.or rather was the recording industry burnt out on the heavy metal/hair band scene at that exact point in time that preceeded Nirvana's entrance? Its almost like Nirvana was simply at the right place at the right time. Soon after Nirvana hit the spotlight, along came a bunch of other Seattle based grunge bands,.ala SoundGarden, Pearl Jam, and Alice in Chains. Almost makes you wonder if one of the other 3 bands aforementioned had released their first studio album before Nirvana, would they be regarded as the "break-through" alternative band,..would say, SoundGarden be held in this high esteem of being the grunge band that sank the hair metal scene rather than Nirvana? that is something worthy to ponder, isnt it class?
But I decided to do even further research into this. I wiki'ed Nirvana, Kurt Cobain, and Courtney Love. Some interesting reads here on Wikipedia, feel free to help yourself to them as well, anytime, as I cant possibly list every embarrasing thing about Cobain, Love, or Nirvana. It says Cobain befriended a gay boy in grade school and was often bullied because of this. Well damn..Kurt,.remember,.its the late 1970's, and youre gonna get your ass kicked on the playground at recess for acting gay or supporing it, because being gay wont become a cool thing until President Clinton takes office. Kurt himself even goes on to state that if he never married Courtney, he would have more than likely lived out a bisexual life. It also mentions that Cobain often dispised the way a lot of his music was mixed, and felt that they way it sounds on the finished albums was not his true intent. really now? Gee, this band, regarded by many as being forerunners of the grunge scene in the early 1990's, doesnt even possess the skills needed to make their music sound the way they want it to. Newsflash: If your album doesnt sound the exact way you want it to,.dont release the damn thing. and with that being said, it sounds almost as if there are some skills they are hindered in. perhaps?
Then there's Courtney Love, who's real name is Courtney Harrison, not really sure why she decided to change it. Because once she married Cobain, it pretty much should have changed again too..but never did, cause she was so stuck on Love. anyhoot... Wiki spells it all out, that she is nothing more than a music industry whore who flirts from one rocker to another..OR SLEPT WITH THEM..who knows, right?, simply trying to use any and all applicable musicians who encountered her as nothing more than leverage to only further her career. Maybe this was the reason she decided to marry Cobain in 1991, before the advent of Nevermind was released. perhaps she saw the potential of the album and was willing to give Cobain a chance.she wanted in on the upcoming wave of cashflow to be expected from this album, not to mention the attention it would render. Could this also be the reason she became worried at every suicide attempt Cobain made, knowing that, without him, she might not have yet a chance to reach her true career goals. she didnt get where she wanted with Billy Corgan, and now it seemed her own hubbie wasnt getting her that ticket yet either.
It wasnt too much later after Nirvana's death,.err,.Cobain's..that Courtney felt she had everything she needed to start up her own group "Hole"...probably referring to the large gap she now felt that was left by Cobain's departure.
The true talent of Nirvana was only yet to first be experienced in 1995, with the entrance of a band called "The Foo Fighters". Drummer Dave Grohl decided he had enough of Kurt's "I-feel-sorry-for-myself-and-I-am-going-to-overdose" rants, and his shotgun suicide was the icing on the cake as far as Grohl was concerned, that prompted him to create the Foo Fighters. I often wonder if Grohl contemplated leaving Nirvana while Cobain was alive and starting the Foo Fighters then,.it would be interesting to see if Nirvana would have folded at that point. Dave Grohl was the true talent in Nirvana all along, he was the drummer that held Nirvana's beat in rhythm, he is what made Cobain's nails-on-chalkboard voice sound somewhat palatable to the ears. Poor Grohl, he was living back there on that drumset, hidden in Cobain's shadow, and even a dozen years since his death, Grohl still cant escape the haunts and taunts of Nirvana's past,.despite releasing countless hit songs and albums under the Foo Fighters. and just where is Novoselic? we dont see or hear much of him anymore these days.
So now here we go and explore more about Kurt.Some hold Kurt in high regard, and think of him in the same respect as the legendary John Lennon...and why do so many compare Kurt Cobain to John Lennon?,They dont look alike, they dont sound alike,.I dont get it. Even saying Kurt cobain and John Lennon in the same sentence is queer. Why do these analogies even exist? John Lennon was murdered by a psycho, without any previous knowledge that this threat lured weeks before it transpired. In Contrast,.Kurt Cobain is a psyhco who contemplated for weeks on end about murdering himself, and finally achieved his goal. I think Kurt was scared frankly,.he knew of Courtney's intent to soon release her debut Hole album, and was scared this would steal thunder away from Nirvana, and decided it would be best,.as quoted by Neil Young.."better to go out with a bang , than fade away". Kurt was cremated, some of his ashes were spread about in New York, some were spread about the Wishkah river,.(whereever that place is),.and the rest were given to Courtney Love so she could snort the rest up with her daily dose of crack.
Taking everything into consideration here, I could pretty much sum Nirvana up. They were a band that came into the rock scene at a time when the rock industry was bored with hair metal.And even though they had less than 5 studio albums in under the course of about 4 years, they did quite well for that short time. Their unique sound and luck of their timing had catapulted them into stardom fast. Kurt couldnt handle the attention, and furthermore, couldnt bare the thought of his own wife releasing her own album, and possibly soon splitting with him,.both marital and careerwise, so he took his own life. that sucks Kurt. you built up a large fan base, you failed at maintaining this fan base, you shuddered up on us, and escaped from it all. Thats being a coward. The only other person cool enough to do that was Elvis, and youre not that damn cool.
So what really happened to Kurt? obviously he isnt around anymore, and neither is Nirvana for that matter. He commited suicide, although conspiracy theories do exist, about how he was murdered and there never was any of his own fingerprints to be found on the trigger of the gun. Kurt exited
I know that in this age, any aspiring grade school kid that looks cute and pretty (or cute or pretty-take your choice) can easily get a recording contract and have a professional digitally alter and tune their voices to perfection. There are already many bands like this,.Incubus, Lil Bow Wow, Britney Spears, Alicia Keyes, Godsmack, Puddle of Mudd, Hanson, System of a Down, Good Charlotte, Bad Charlotte, and anyone who got fame from American Idol,... just to name a few. But this is the 1980's that we are talking about!! for crying out loud.., back when bands actually played their own instruments,.and when the unknown Cobain was trying diligently to break into the music industry,.only to become overwhelmed by it and kill himself after only releasing a handful of some studio albums. damn that sucks,.work so hard to break into the industry only to try to escape what you tried so hard at breaking into in the first place.
But even if Nirvana's albums never sounded the way they intended, it sure the hell sounds better than a lot of the trash that stinks up the radio airwaves today. all of these sugar-coated bubblegum pop rock bands that get continous airplay,.(cough,.yellowcard: "lights and sounds")..and with that being taking into consideration, i do have to take the time to thank them for the music we did recieve in their short time. It wasnt a masterpiece by any standards, but I do like it. Yes I do think Nirvana was over-hyped, but then again, I always forget that an overhyped band is what sells lots of albums and that 13 year olds are the ones who really determine what bands stay on the billboard charts. even though I like their music it,.I dont worship Nirvana, even though their name implies a Buddhist state of Zen. Nuff saID.
Posted 16 October 2006 - 05:43 PM
Nevermind was not suppose to be a 'grunge' album. Cobain wanted to add pop sounds in the same way New Wave added pop flavour to punk. Bleach was a grunge album and did not sell well. Nevermind was a mixture of both pop and grunge and it made history. Cobain also claimed that by the end of that album, grunge was dead and he felt that In Utero was the furthest thing from the grunge genre. From the 'get go' they never really considered themselves grunge, that was a label given to them. Kurt always thought they'd be seen as the next 'new wave' band. Although in an interview he said he was proud of being called grunge, just as long as the band can expand in other directions and leave the old scene behind.
Prior to Nevermind, there was no major important rock band. Guns and Roses were big but lots of people hated them (nirvana and stone roses included). Nirvana was the yank equivalent of the Stone Roses. They shut the doors on 80s pop bands (Arena rock, and sythy stuff) and opened to the doors to a more real and hard edged sound.
Nirvana's success gave birth to mainstream alternative in the mid 90s. Stone Roses did the same thing for Brit Pop. Noel, from Oasis, said that their latest album was the first honest attempt at not sounding like John Squire (Stone Roses).
Yes. The songs are so easy to play and sound great. Of course their timing was right. Timing is everything. But from all the bands at that time that were about to bust, they were the ones that came out first. The album Nevermind was not a marketing success, that came after, the album itself was brilliant and people loved it for what it was. The whole grunge, doc martens, plaid, self-loathing culture came after the success of the album, which sold on it's own merits.
The comparrison to John Lennon is that they both were impact players. They impacted the music industry and unwillingly were the voices of their generation. Nirvana didn't create grunge or the culture, but they brought it to the world. And Cobains tragic character also lended much to his legend. People could relate to his outcast appeal and apperciated the honesty in his de-glossified MTV videos.
Listening to his sketchy voice and rusty accoustic playing on UNPLUGGED makes you wonder why it was so kick ass. It was his feeble qualities that made it good. He breathed new life into the track Dumb and even surpassed the plugged versions of About a Girl, Come as you are, and On a Plain.
He did not have a great voice, was not a great guitarist, and did not mug for attention. Yet his Band, under his song writing, became larger than life.
They sold out venues. The audience was not 13. I think Kurt wanted all age audiences but I'm pretty sure most of them were 18+. And there is nothing wrong with selling to 13 year olds. It's they that will be the next generation in music so it's nice to know they are listening to quality. Jack White, Paul Banks, and so forth were probably 13 in 1991. I was younger but remember hearing nirvana and just loving the sound.
This post has been edited by Jordan: 16 October 2006 - 05:47 PM
Posted 16 October 2006 - 06:10 PM
Posted 17 October 2006 - 05:40 AM
Posted 17 October 2006 - 01:02 PM
Wanting to write a catchy tune is "selling out?" Huh, I thought that was just not being a musical retard.
Posted 17 October 2006 - 01:45 PM
Nobody was walking around in Seattle (1988-90) saying "man this grunge is so good" Nirvana was just a band that used the buzz, surrounding the seattle scene, as a launch board to the main stream.
Like I said, Kurt always considered himself new wave rather than grunge. They wanted to sell albums and make a living off it. Not be pretentious underground elitests living off of cardboard and shitting in a jar.
Posted 17 October 2006 - 09:53 PM
All Apologies for the longwindedness.
Edit 2: Not cool my pants are on fire. Bleach is catchy, its just takes some extra effort to like it. Its called not being a douchebag who cant listen to music that isn't drowning in studio effects and reverb. Go listen to some creed, they should be like Bach to you.
EDIT 3: Sorry, maybe a bit too harsh. I'm kinda thinking I was a douchebag for most of my freshman year...
This post has been edited by Wayne: 17 October 2006 - 10:08 PM
Posted 18 October 2006 - 03:00 AM
God damnit man, how can you NOT pull out the old air guitar when Smells like Teen Spirit comes on?
What about the Unplugged versions of Nevermind tracks?
I think you like different things than I when it comes to music or at least when it comes to Nirvana. I liked all their cds. I thought Nevermind was friggen awesome. Teen Spirit is a Pixies knock off, according to kurt (he was at least brutaly honest when it came to interviews), and the Pixies sound never gets old, imo. I guess tracks like Lithium are kind of slow but the chorus is pretty catchy. That was a fan favorite to sing along to.
Posted 18 October 2006 - 07:55 AM
Power pop is glorious. How dare you, sir. HOW DARE YOU.
I think maybe you might be trying to say something along the lines of "bubblegum pop?" Because power pop is a pretty awesome genre of music. Big Star, the Replacements, the Lemonheads, the Posies, Material Issue, the Pernice Brothers, Marshall Crenshaw, Matthew Sweet, Teenage Fanclub...those are all acts usually deemed to be "power pop," and I'm sorry, but if you're declaring all of them to be bad, well, that's just awful.
What the fuck? Where did I say Bleach wasn't catchy or a good album? I simply don't see a problem with Nevermind being even catchier. I prefer In Utero, but I still think bashing an album for being "too catchy" in all the right ways is pretty ludicrous. Writing a well-crafted song that sticks in your head is a pretty tough thing to do. You're basically saying it's a bad thing to want to sometimes write songs that are instantly catchy or memorable or even radio-ready. It's like you're automatically putting that on the level of, say, Britney Spears. Nevermind has a glossier production value, but that's hardly a death-knell for an album. Why is maybe wanting an album to sound as clear or as rich as possible a bad thing? It's not like they were out there with some paid-for-hire assclown to shine up the music...it was Butch Vig and then Steve Albini! Suddenly declaring these guys to be the architects of "glossy pop selling out" is absurd.
And the Creed comment was pretty fucking low. Because I don't prefer the muddied, aimless sound of Bleach over songs that know a good fucking tune AND rocks my socks' socks off suddenly makes me a Creed fan? Please. Get over your "indie-r than thou" attitude.
Posted 21 October 2006 - 06:37 PM
Creed?.....Its one thing to do a cover of another artist's song because either a band hasnt come up with any new material, or feels their version of the song is better, or is trying to pay tribute..........but its totally flipping jacked when a band tries to entirely rip off the sound of another band with such obvious intent,...such being the case of the infamous Pearl Jam wanna-be's known as Creed. They might as well just saved some face, and called themselves a Pearl Jam tribute band instead, that would have at least been a whole lot more respectable to them.
Scott Stapp is trying so hard to sound like Vedder it isnt even funny. when i first heard "arms wide open",.i freaking thought it was a pearl jam song.
Posted 24 October 2006 - 07:11 PM