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Bob Dylan Can Go To Hell Thursday, September 7, 2006

#16 User is offline   Jordan Icon

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Posted 09 September 2006 - 03:40 PM

When you distill the man down to his essence, you'll find something along the lines of Dana Carvey's Grumpy Old Man.

He hates modern life. The music confuses him and the technology scares him.
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Posted 09 September 2006 - 04:46 PM

I know that some people don't like changes and probably what he said was an indication that he is frightened. He could had expressed his thoughts in a careful way:
QUOTE
"Bob Dylan: CDs are small. There's no stature to it."

"In my day, I believe the bigger something is the better."

QUOTE
Bob Dylan: "You listen to these modern records, they're atrocious, they have sound all over them. There's no definition of nothing, no vocal, no nothing, just like -- static."

"I listen to these modern records, they sound very bad to me as they have sounds all over them I can't understand. There's no definition of nothing to my own standards of vocals, they are just not my taste to how I would perform."

Would it be fair to say this:
"In my time with record players and fewer players on my field, technology then was simple for me to use but now I have been overtaken both ways and I find that just frightening."

This post has been edited by Deepsycher: 09 September 2006 - 04:50 PM

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#18 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 09 September 2006 - 11:55 PM

Blargh. Well, defender of an unpopular idea, here I go.

Bob Dylan has a lot to be revered for. His songs have touched generations both from him and from people covering them, though several of his songs are best done by him.

Listen to The Times They Are-a-changing, Mr. Jones, or Hurricane. I admit that Dylan may not have the best voice and he's more suited to be a poet than anything, but hearing it raw and honest is something that's definately different. A scratchy smokers voice can even become beautiful when it's spouting poetry like Dylan writes.

And even if you don't respect his music you have to dig his company. Dylan was once introduced by Martin Luther King, he's hung out with the Beatles and Ginsberg, and his songs have been the source of names for groups like The Rolling Stones and the revolutionary group The Weathermen.

As for giving everybody must get stoned a silly title, think about it. When did that come out? Was it not at a time when there were movies out discussing how marijuana users jacked off constantly when they couldn't find a rape victim? Of course you can't say "Everybody must get stoned" on an album jacket. It would be the equivalent of a modern band writing a song called "Let's do heroin and then blow up our school!" Plus silly titles are the very LEAST of what musicians can do, and it's not an isolated incident: who could forget "Revolution 9" by the beatles, which is simply a bunch of sound bites and someone saying "number eight." and Sliver by Nirvana was a purposeful attempt by Cobain and his friends to make people screw up the name and think it said Silver.

Dylan isn't being an old curmudgeon. A lot of modern music is indeed shit. Just ask Chyld, it dosn't take Bob Dylan to figure that out. And Dylan is a hell of a lot more in touch with the youth of today than most people his age might be. As for the complaining about CDs, all artists who knew records have done this. You simply can't have as much fun with a CD as with a vinyl LP. The reason is, as someone pointed out, size. Imagine Seargeant Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club coming out as a cd? Would the cover be anywhere near as neat to look at? The cover art and extras tossed in were half the fun for records, you could use them as posters afterwards. But you can't do that with CDs, it really does take a bit of the fun away from the artist.

And the fact that Dylan endorses the iPod isn't such a sell out, it's showing that he knows something about modern culture, a tacit endorsement of music downloading and such. Compare this to people half Dylan's age who are doing whiney bullshit commercials about how when you download from the net you're raping Lithuanian orphans or some shit.

I for one really enjoy Bob Dylan and his music, and I don't think he's awful for trying to promote himself or his music in an interview about himself and his music. He hardly ever gives interviews, which is because they probably do make him feel dirty. When a musician or a writer or whatever does an interview no one wants to hear about the person (unless it's some bullshit scandal rag) they just want to hear about the product, the image, whatever is going to shift those units off the shelf. That's how the world goes and Dylan is naturally a part of that world. Calling Bob Dylan self important is moot when there are hundreds of rappers sitting in hot tubs with women wearing hundred dollar bills whose music consists entirely of talking about how great they are and how many times they got 'capped'.

Akhem. End rant.

This post has been edited by J m HofMarN: 10 September 2006 - 12:03 AM

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Posted 10 September 2006 - 03:27 AM

I knew before reading your post exactly everything you'd say. I'd like to point out that I only quoted that song to show how bad the rhymes were; I don't care about the title. Dylan was pandering in that song, by the way, singing about "stoning," the punishment where folks throw rocks at you, when he knew that hippies would listen casually and hear "get stoned," and then jump up and down over what an iconoclast Dylan was. It was just as bad as "Lucy in the Sky With Diamonds," obviously about LSD. John Lennon chickened out big time when he refused to admit that and instead said he got the song title from his son. Blame the kids, sure.

I agree with you that Dylan has some great songs behind him, and with Nate that this new album is utter shite. I also agree with Nate that Dylan covers are always better than Dylan recordings, except for "Knocking on Heaven's Door," which he handled just fine. But then that's true of Leonard Cohen as well, and I love Leopnard Cohen. But regardless of how you look at it, saying CDs (eg digital recording) are terrible by definition and then starring in an iPod ad is by definition hypocritical. You would be an amazing rehtoritician if you could convince me otherwise.

Dylan has gone too long with zero criticism, and has a swollen head from constantly being revered as a living legend of musical genius. This should make him humble; it should not give him license to say that two entire decades of music are total garbage, that all modern music is sonic bombardment, that no one would be able to make music like they did up to 1986. I know he's just referring to the year that CDs came out, but the assumption that this technology change produced a side-effect of destroying all music is just typical old man behaviour. I laugh that by this assumption he managed to include the vinyl release "Thriller" as an acceptable album but excludes "The Joshua Tree" and "Graceland," both early adopters of CD.

In his own day, I think the only person publicly to criticize him for being a pretentious windbag was fellow pretentious windbag Paul Simon. His "Simple Desultory Phillipic" is a parody of Dylan's style, and it's just as bad as any of Dylan's worst stuff.
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Posted 10 September 2006 - 08:20 AM

He was on the academy awards a few years ago, and you'd think that John Lennon had come back to life, the way everyone was fawning over him.

Don't know if it's true. Think I read it in the Peter Brown book. Supposedly Bob Dylan introduced the Beatles to marijuana. The fab 4 had been taking uppers since the Hamburg days, but Dylan visited them in NYC and was like "no, you need to turn on to mother earth..."

I'd be willing to give him some credit for that action as a young man. Their Album covers became more interesting anyway. And as for the song title? If he had the groupies the Beatles did, the song title makes a lot more sense to me now.

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#21 User is offline   Chefelf Icon

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Posted 10 September 2006 - 09:27 AM

QUOTE (J m HofMarN @ Sep 10 2006, 12:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Dylan isn't being an old curmudgeon. A lot of modern music is indeed shit. Just ask Chyld, it dosn't take Bob Dylan to figure that out. And Dylan is a hell of a lot more in touch with the youth of today than most people his age might be. As for the complaining about CDs, all artists who knew records have done this. You simply can't have as much fun with a CD as with a vinyl LP. The reason is, as someone pointed out, size. Imagine Seargeant Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club coming out as a cd? Would the cover be anywhere near as neat to look at? The cover art and extras tossed in were half the fun for records, you could use them as posters afterwards. But you can't do that with CDs, it really does take a bit of the fun away from the artist.


Ehhhh, I don't buy that. Physical size? If anyone's having trouble making out CD cover then perhaps some prescription glasses are in order. Also, music is music. If it takes a backseat to having a giant piece of art attached to it then the music probably doesn't have much going on anyway. If you're that concerned, include a poster-sized fold out or, in this day and age, just have an accompanying website where you can put your artwork for people to see. Bob Dylan isn't really referring to the physical size but even if he were the music should be able to stand on its own apart from the cover art.

QUOTE (J m HofMarN @ Sep 10 2006, 12:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
And the fact that Dylan endorses the iPod isn't such a sell out, it's showing that he knows something about modern culture, a tacit endorsement of music downloading and such. Compare this to people half Dylan's age who are doing whiney bullshit commercials about how when you download from the net you're raping Lithuanian orphans or some shit.


I don't particularly care about "selling out" but what we're talking about here is complete hypocrisy. If he had just done the iPod commercial (without the recent interview comments to draw on) I probably wouldn't even have noticed and would have only groaned at the sight of him.

QUOTE (J m HofMarN @ Sep 10 2006, 12:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Calling Bob Dylan self important is moot when there are hundreds of rappers sitting in hot tubs with women wearing hundred dollar bills whose music consists entirely of talking about how great they are and how many times they got 'capped'.


I don't think so. I have more respect for the 'big roller' who buys all the fancy cars and hot tubs that they can because at least they don't consider themselves the arbiters of all that is good and correct in the world of music. Sure, for the most part I don't like a large amount of their music, but they are far less phony. They may come out and say, "Listen, I made an assload of money and I'm going to buy 15 Hummers and have an Xbox 360 in my toilet." If they claimed to be wanting to help orphaned Tibetan refugees and then bought a swimming pool made out of solid gold then maybe it would be bad.

Making the argument that "Bob Dylan spoke to a generation" and rappers are just terrible is the argument that someone's grandma would have made about Bob Dylan when he first came out. Sure he spoke to a generation but it wasn't hers. The rappers in the hot tubs are also speaking to a generation. They aren't selling 10,000,000 albums to nobody. Just because we aren't the generation they're speaking to doesn't make them any less valid.
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Posted 10 September 2006 - 12:58 PM

QUOTE (Chefelf @ Sep 10 2006, 09:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Just because we aren't the generation they're speaking to doesn't make them any less valid.

No, don't you see: it makes their generation less valid!

Hoffie has a fairly common ailment, generation envy. He is sure he'd be happier had he been born in the early 50s instead of the early 70s. Maybe he even feels that had he been born in the late 20s he would even have been happier. It's easier to whitewash an earlier era and focus only on its pop culture and a watered-down idea of its politics, in order to make it seem generally more favourable when compared with our complicated times.

In feeling, though, I almost agree with him. The kids impressed by rappers and the hip hop stars who be screaming "bitches" and "pimp yo hos" and all that will froget about it in a decade. The music and the messages are not enduring, and certainly wil be embarrassing to an adult. I don't understand the appeal; rappers are about as attractive to me as the mobsters they pretend to be. While I may like GOODFELLAS, that doesn't mean I am interested in mobsters. Music based on love of that movie would not have any appeal for me. Hip hop on the other hand owes a lot to worship of the De Palma film SCARFACE. Of course this may be the curmudgeon talking, but that I don't get. They're singing about a movie? Well ok, but why couldn't it have been a really good one?

Back on topic: Dylan sucks.

QUOTE (Chefelf @ Sep 10 2006, 09:27 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Just because we aren't the generation they're speaking to doesn't make them any less valid.

No, don't you see: it makes their generation less valid!

Hoffie has a fairly common ailment, generation envy. He is sure he'd be happier had he been born in the early 50s instead of the early 70s. Maybe he even feels that had he been born in the late 20s he would even have been happier. It's easier to whitewash an earlier era and focus only on its pop culture and a watered-down idea of its politics, in order to make it seem generally more favourable when compared with our complicated times.

In feeling, though, I almost agree with him. The kids impressed by rappers and the hip hop stars who be screaming "bitches" and "pimp yo hos" and all that will froget about it in a decade. The music and the messages are not enduring, and certainly wil be embarrassing to an adult. I don't understand the appeal; rappers are about as attractive to me as the mobsters they pretend to be. While I may like GOODFELLAS, that doesn't mean I am interested in mobsters. Music based on love of that movie would not have any appeal for me. Hip hop on the other hand owes a lot to worship of the De Palma film SCARFACE. Of course this may be the curmudgeon talking, but that I don't get. They're singing about a movie? Well ok, but why couldn't it have been a really good one?

Back on topic: Dylan sucks.
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#23 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 10 September 2006 - 10:57 PM

Civ:

QUOTE
Dylan was pandering in that song, by the way, singing about "stoning," the punishment where folks throw rocks at you, when he knew that hippies would listen casually and hear "get stoned," and then jump up and down over what an iconoclast Dylan was.


One could certainly draw parallels between the two, seeing as people were often persecuted for their marijuana use. I see it as a rather clever double meaning and social comment, I don't see why you view it as some sort of effort to take advantage of people. Dylan smoked marijuana, and as I pointed out with the climate of the times he couldn't have made a song that was a straight endorsement of that drug.

QUOTE
This should make him humble; it should not give him license to say that two entire decades of music are total garbage, that all modern music is sonic bombardment, that no one would be able to make music like they did up to 1986


He's entitled to his own opinion, though I definately don't agree with it. I think that someone of that age who is into music has definately got reason to be pissed for a reason that Nate would be familiar with: Having to buy a thousand different editions of things. Dylan's been through the years of records, eight tracks, tapes, cds, and now digital music. I'd be a bit pissed too if I had to continuously update my music collection. However I should point out that there have to be acceptions in his statement. His own son, Jakob, is the lead singer for a band that was operating in the 90s, The Gin Blossoms I believe.

QUOTE
Hoffie has a fairly common ailment, generation envy. He is sure he'd be happier had he been born in the early 50s instead of the early 70s. Maybe he even feels that had he been born in the late 20s he would even have been happier. It's easier to whitewash an earlier era and focus only on its pop culture and a watered-down idea of its politics, in order to make it seem generally more favourable when compared with our complicated times.


Or better yet, in the 2120s, when I would be able to speed through the wastelands of post apocalyptic America wielding my katana in one hand and guitar in the other and summoning the radioactive Steven Segal to split kick those enemies who wouldn't bow to my mastery of the ultra guitar style... But I digress.

QUOTE
In feeling, though, I almost agree with him. The kids impressed by rappers and the hip hop stars who be screaming "bitches" and "pimp yo hos" and all that will froget about it in a decade.


No way man! You old fogies just don't understand. Your generation might have had the summer of love and Woodstock, but our generation has the summer of thuggin it and.. ummm... this one time I sold drugs to people. In the hizzy, no less.

QUOTE
Also, music is music. If it takes a backseat to having a giant piece of art attached to it then the music probably doesn't have much going on anyway.


I beg to differ. There is some music that wouldn't be anywhere near as cool without the images with it. For instance, the videos to Intergalactic and Sabotage by The Beasties really made the songs for me. That's how bands express themselves in the video era, but before that you had to do your thing in your album, that was the canvas. Music videos, however, are costly and therefore not nearly as democratic a medeum as album covers, and they also create a much greater emphasis on image than was previously known.

I'm not arguing against CDs or music videos, just pointing out why someone might have a problem with the current state of music.

QUOTE
Sure, for the most part I don't like a large amount of their music, but they are far less phony.


I havn't really heard enough about Bob Dylan to defend him or condemn him on this issue. I DO however know that he was slated to attend an anti-war rally I attended, but Joan Baez ended up playing it instead, so I'm assuming he's still fighting the good fight and dosn't own any solid gold pools.

QUOTE
the argument that someone's grandma would have made about Bob Dylan when he first came out.


Actually Dylan was a continuance of music that peoples grandmothers might have listened to at that time. Before he was famous Dylan showed up on the doorstep of a dying old man whose name was...
Woody Guthrie. Guthrie and Dylan struck up a friendship just before the older man died and Dylan took a lot of his folksy style from the older man. Guthrie, in fact, was not only largely acceptable but revered in his time for championing the rights of the working class, and it was music that pretty much anyone could listen to. So is Bob Dylan, really. The lyrics are timeless and Dylan's own sound is far from threatening when compared with other groups that emerged in the sixties, though I dig the sound of The Doors or The Who, etc.

QUOTE
They aren't selling 10,000,000 albums to nobody.


The music industry and mass society sell those albums, not any actual talent. There are some hip hop and rap groups from the early nineties that really did have something good to say, that spoke to people. Public Enemy would be a prime example. I'm not saying that all hip hop is crap, but since the breakout of Nirvana and real rap there has been a complete staleness in American music except for older bands that are still rocking out and of course the punk scene which I think is probably the most vibrant and relevent genre of music in America today.

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Posted 11 September 2006 - 01:41 AM

Ok, I'm not sure you got my point about Rainy Day Women, so here it is again without the chorus designed to make dumb hippies whoop it up like it's a song about sticking it to the stuffy old man:

"Well, they'll stone ya when you're trying to be so good,
They'll stone ya just a-like they said they would.
They'll stone ya when you're tryin' to go home.
Then they'll stone ya when you're there all alone.

"Well, they'll stone ya when you're walkin' 'long the street.
They'll stone ya when you're tryin' to keep your seat.
They'll stone ya when you're walkin' on the floor.
They'll stone ya when you're walkin' to the door.

"They'll stone ya when you're at the breakfast table.
They'll stone ya when you are young and able.
They'll stone ya when you're tryin' to make a buck.
They'll stone ya and then they'll say, "good luck."

"Well, they'll stone you and say that it's the end.
Then they'll stone you and then they'll come back again.
They'll stone you when you're riding in your car.
They'll stone you when you're playing your guitar.

"Well, they'll stone you when you walk all alone.
They'll stone you when you are walking home.
They'll stone you and then say you are brave.
They'll stone you when you are set down in your grave."


You see, it's a shit song with terrible forced rhymes.

All that other stuff about whether he's a curmudgeon or not is just personality. He's simply flat-out wrong when he suggests musical culture went down the toilet with the introduction of a single different technology, and I'm sorry if I don't worship the Beach Boys the way every asshole from the 60s seems to want me to. But back to the point, if those same comments had been made by George Bush, you'd disagree with him. But since they're being made by someone you want to defend, you are willing to meet him more than halfway. That is characteristic of the "personality" argument; it doesn't matter what you say becasue folks who like you will agree. He's still wrong, and he said some arrogant things and he insulted an entire generation. Hopping on the itunes bandwagon after insulting an entire generation is just awesome hypocrisy. Even if I think some of his songs are all right (though I have always felt that he was overrated), I have to lean towards Nate's conclusion, that this guy is full of himself and he's not above making money off stuff while insulting it at the same time.

I saw Dylan on the Academy Awards a few years back and couldn't make out a single word he said. The acoustics were awesome however.

Dylan is playing in Vancouver pretty soon. Paul Simon too. Paul Simon is playing at an intimate theatre where the acoustics will be awesome, and he's playing two nights to accommodate the smaller crowds. The tickets are higher as well, since there are so few seats, btu the show is guaranteed to be more enjoyable than the hockey stadium show Dylan has planned. Guess which one I bought tickets to?
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Posted 11 September 2006 - 09:50 AM

True story: when I was 11 years old (and thought I knew everything), my music teacher gave us an assignment: to bring in a song, play it for the class and then critique the lyrics, the music, etc., positively or negatively. In my 11-year-old wisdom, I chose "A Hard Rain's a Gonna Fall," by Mr. Dylan, and wrote what I considered to be a scathing critique of Bob's nasal, whiny voice and nonsensical lyrics. I read my review to my father, who sat silent, and then said, "Jenny, I know you don't care for Bob's song, but I can't, in good conscience, let you go to school and denounce one of the most influential protest songs of my generation because you don't understand it all yet." Chastened, I rewrote my review to make the same points about "The Man in The Long Black Coat."

And you know what? 15 years later, I see a lot of beauty in the poetry of both those songs that I didn't see in Grade 6, and I can appreciate the effect of Dylan's voice, which is all to say that I don't necessarily agree with Chefelf in how much he hates Dylan. But I do think he (Dylan, not Chefelf) is being a big fat hypocrite by denouncing modern technology, and then further by taking that stance and yet endorsing iTunes. And JM, I don't think he said anywhere that he hated modern music because it meant he had to replace his collection -- he rather explicitly said that music is WORSE now because of technology, an odd pose for the man who "electrified" folk to take.

And, JM, Civ and Tipper Gore: Wah, wah, [hip-hop today] doesn't have the meaning music used to. Wah, wah, [gangster rap] is all about drugs/violence/whatever -- not like the music <I>I</I>. Fill in the blanks with rock and roll, the blues, heavy metal, jazz, grunge, and hell, probably Tin Pan Alley and it would be the same thing -- people have been singing that song to denounce "music of today" since Mozart first put pen to paper, and probably before. You think all hip-hop is about thugging, pimping and drugs? Well, I suspect you of limited exposure to the genre, and I suspect you of making a pretty superficial critique -- every musical movement produces a lot of crap, but if it's a genre that thrives, it thrives because it speaks to people. You don't have to like it, or appreciate it, but to dismiss it as throwaway music that won't speak to people in a decade is naive. smile.gif

Oh, yeah, and Jakob Dylan's band is the Wallflowers. happy.gif
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Post icon  Posted 11 September 2006 - 12:47 PM

Yay! This thread made me entertained, then sad, then angry, then nostalgic...now lunch is over & it's time to work again! It has truly encapsulated what the internet is into a few short minutes! wub.gif

For some reason I think the only thing left to add is quote Samuel L. "MuthaF*kin" Jackson from the Abridged Script of The Phantom Menace:
QUOTE
I'm gonna be a f*ckin bad ass in the next two f*ckin movies, you know. My toy has a f*ckin lightsaber.

Indeed. Because Bob Dylan is tired of these muthaf*ckin music in this muthaf*ckin industry. yell.gif
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Posted 11 September 2006 - 01:37 PM

The comment about 20 years worth of bad music is the one that really got me going.

Songs with lots of sound and thick with guitar rifs are what people have wanted for the past 20 years. Listen to the Beatles, Beach Boys, Doors etc.. you'll find that the popular style back then had a thinner sound. There was not so much 'noise' and people liked it.

Today, we want noise. I want to hear songs with consistency with 3 guitars, a bass, a set of drums, and maybe a keyboard.

I can't rock out to oldies. I can listen to them and enjoy them, but they don't get my blood boiling or my adrenaline jumping. I wouldn't say that music from 1950-1970 was garbage with not one good record in existence. It's just a different sound for a different time. Cleaner rock and roll was the way to go.

Dylan is stuck in that time frame and he doesn't like new music. That's fine, he's 60 years old. He can even say "I'm not really into modern style." But to say the last two decades have not produced a quality album is really stupid.

I think Dylan sucks. I think his voice is ridiculous and the fact that he wipes out a harmonica during the instrumental makes me cringe. However, if I was some big time rock star and an interviewer challenged me with the question "do you think Bob Dylan and the older style is superior to the sounds we hear now". I'd say no, however I won't go off on how low-technology and cleaner rock is bullocks.

I think it would be sweet if some big name modern day musician retorted to his comments in another interivew. I'm sure journalists have confronted a few artists on their feelings regarding Dylans comments, but I'm sure they'd be to afraid to show him up. Rollingstone would probably write a segement on how modern artists dont' respect their grass roots and all that crap.

Dylan's comment was overboard, he's not the watchdog of the industry.

This post has been edited by Jordan: 11 September 2006 - 01:39 PM

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#28 User is offline   civilian_number_two Icon

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Posted 12 September 2006 - 02:53 AM

QUOTE (Jen @ Sep 11 2006, 09:50 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You don't have to like it, or appreciate it, but to dismiss it as throwaway music that won't speak to people in a decade is naive. smile.gif

I'm sure I'm equally naive when I say that country music now is just rock with twangy guitar, and that the lyrics are just glorified soap opera treatments. I'm sure a rfeal fan of the genre would be able to find the 10% of country music that really does sound like roots country, and whose lyrics are meaningful and enduring. So too hip hop superfan (I was really picking on hip hop, not rap) can find the possibly 5% that isn't just sampled pop from the 70s and 80s intercut with ganagsta bullshit pimp worship and bling. Those folks would be thanked for their efforts since that's something I have no time for.

On the other hand I have heard many a contemporary song that I like, and some of it is dance music. I can't dismiss an entire generation, but come on. There's loads of good classic rock, but not loads of good hip hop. Sure it's a matter of taste and opinion, but since when have I ever said that anyone else's tastes and opinions mattered? wink.gif
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#29 User is offline   Jen Icon

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Posted 12 September 2006 - 02:49 PM

QUOTE (civilian_number_two @ Sep 12 2006, 03:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
On the other hand I have heard many a contemporary song that I like, and some of it is dance music. I can't dismiss an entire generation, but come on. There's loads of good classic rock, but not loads of good hip hop. Sure it's a matter of taste and opinion, but since when have I ever said that anyone else's tastes and opinions mattered? wink.gif


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#30 User is offline   Chefelf Icon

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Posted 12 September 2006 - 06:03 PM

QUOTE (Jordan @ Sep 11 2006, 02:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I think it would be sweet if some big name modern day musician retorted to his comments in another interivew. I'm sure journalists have confronted a few artists on their feelings regarding Dylans comments, but I'm sure they'd be to afraid to show him up. Rollingstone would probably write a segement on how modern artists dont' respect their grass roots and all that crap.


If only Frank Zappa was still alive. He'd surely have been the one to do it.

QUOTE (civilian_number_two @ Sep 12 2006, 03:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
So too hip hop superfan (I was really picking on hip hop, not rap) can find the possibly 5% that isn't just sampled pop from the 70s and 80s intercut with ganagsta bullshit pimp worship and bling. Those folks would be thanked for their efforts since that's something I have no time for.


There was this great show called, "The Bridge" that highlighted all "classic" hip hop from New York from about 1980 to 1993. It seems to have recently gotten off track, but the original season of the show (that I was clever enough to have recorded on my ReplayTV) really shows a great history of the genre featuring songs and groups from a time when hip hop was still developing. Most of the music during that time period was experimental, intelligent and just plain fun. Some was dumb and still more was just crap but there was a large portion of it that was really great and fun to listen to.

I'd recommend anything by De La Soul (at least the first 2-4 albums, depending on your take of when they started their decline), both Leaders of the New School albums, nearly anything by A Tribe Called Quest and I'm sure I'm forgetting a lot of other great artists.

The videos add even more fun to the mix by just featuring a bunch of people (and women who are fully clothed, often times in extraordinarily baggy early 90's attire) seeming to have a good time. Nothing is being flaunted other than concepts such as peace and unity. Kinda like the hippie rock of the late 60's which eventually turned into the "angry rock" of the early 70's.
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