Chefelf.com Night Life: Pro-life or Pro-choice - Chefelf.com Night Life

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Pro-life or Pro-choice what is your stand?

#181 User is offline   barend Icon

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Posted 26 October 2006 - 09:38 PM

QUOTE (Otal Nimrodi @ Oct 26 2006, 07:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
And I BELIEVE that that is a non-sequitor. We aren't discussing Ed Gein.


but Ed Gein's disscusing you. unsure.gif
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#182 User is offline   Slade Icon

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Posted 29 October 2006 - 08:23 PM

Ed Gein is discussing your mom, Barend.

The bigger problem is that it's an argument that appeals purely to emotion. When in doubt, randomly liken your opponent's ideas to those of wacky serial murderers. dry.gif

You can't argue that an embryo or a foetus isn't alive, because it is. Pants, I'm unsure as to what you mean by "human life", and judging by the reactions of other forums, they are, too. Do you mean more you don't feel that an embryo/foetus has as much value as a human as a more developed embryo or post-natal human? And if so, surely you have a better justification than simple life... I just can't tell what you're trying to get at.
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#183 User is offline   Grinov Icon

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Posted 29 October 2006 - 08:54 PM

You know, none of us would be debating this bloody argument if people were just more cautious before having sex.
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#184 User is offline   Sailor Abbey Icon

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Posted 30 October 2006 - 09:09 AM

QUOTE (Slade @ Oct 29 2006, 08:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Ed Gein is discussing your mom, Barend.

The bigger problem is that it's an argument that appeals purely to emotion. When in doubt, randomly liken your opponent's ideas to those of wacky serial murderers. dry.gif


My post had nothing to do with likening pro-choice folks with serial murderers. It had everything to do with pointing out that BELIEVING something does not make it ok.
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#185 User is offline   David-kyo Icon

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Posted 30 October 2006 - 09:10 AM

QUOTE (Grinov @ Oct 30 2006, 03:54 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
You know, none of us would be debating this bloody argument if people were just more cautious before having sex.

But they're not, so we are.
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#186 User is offline   barend Icon

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Posted 30 October 2006 - 10:30 PM

QUOTE (Slade @ Oct 29 2006, 08:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I just can't tell what you're trying to get at.


who me?

if so, my only point here is that like many other things isn't a football game. there are too many factors to just pick a team and start yelling.

i'm sick of this 'yer either fer it or agen it' crap. it's circumstantial. there are more than two sides to this argument. the only thing that should be a solid argument, is that as long as abortions are going to be preformed, those stem cells shouldn't be going to waste.

if not, Ed Gein IS your mom!!!
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#187 User is offline   Madam Corvax Icon

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Posted 31 October 2006 - 02:05 AM

I just want to add, totally out of context, because
a) I haven't been posting for a long time and I won't be in the forseeable future
a) I haven't read the discussion

but I just have to:

Some idiots in my country want to amend the constitution to add words that human life is protected "from the moment od conception".

This virually means:
There will be no abortion in case of rape
There will be no abortion when the mother's life is endangered
There will be no abortion in the foetus is disformed

There will be NO abortion whatsoever.
The of course brings interesting questrion, how about millions of foetuses the nature itself aborts every year? Who is going to be prosecuted for that?

Also, equally out of contest.

Some guys, I believe authors of "freakonomy" argued that the decrease of crime in NEw York in the 90 is caused by the freely available abortion in earlier years. THose who could have been born in pathological families, like drunks, teenage mothers, thieves, very poor people, who are potentially hight risk of becoming criminals just WEREN'T BORN at all, so they weren't able to disrupt the society.

Now, abortion in Poland was virtually banned in mid nineties. I believe those guys who shouldn't have been born now roam freely. And Poland is shocked by a case of 14-year- olds who grabbed their classmate, a girl, IN FRONT of a class, stripped her and simulated rape. The girl commited suicide. And what is worst, most people in that age group just don't understand what happened.

Anyway, got to go.
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#188 User is offline   Sailor Abbey Icon

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Posted 31 October 2006 - 07:58 AM

QUOTE (Madam Corvax @ Oct 31 2006, 02:05 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I just want to add, totally out of context, because
a) I haven't been posting for a long time and I won't be in the forseeable future
a) I haven't read the discussion

but I just have to:

Some idiots in my country want to amend the constitution to add words that human life is protected "from the moment od conception".


Well if its human life its human life. If were going to protect it at 12 months after conception, it should be protected 2 weeks after conception. Or at the very minimum, people should just acknowledge their terminating a human life.

QUOTE (Madam Corvax @ Oct 31 2006, 02:05 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Also, equally out of Some guys, I believe authors of "freakonomy" argued that the decrease of crime in NEw York in the 90 is caused by the freely available abortion in earlier years. THose who could have been born in pathological families, like drunks, teenage mothers, thieves, very poor people, who are potentially hight risk of becoming criminals just WEREN'T BORN at all, so they weren't able to disrupt the society.


Well if that’s the case, I think it should be open season on all crack heads, thieves, and rowdy teenagers. I bet the crime rate in NY would plummet if we were aloud to pick of all the baddies before they did anything else wrong.

QUOTE (Madam Corvax @ Oct 31 2006, 02:05 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Now, abortion in Poland was virtually banned in mid nineties. I believe those guys who shouldn't have been born now roam freely. And Poland is shocked by a case of 14-year- olds who grabbed their classmate, a girl, IN FRONT of a class, stripped her and simulated rape. The girl commited suicide. And what is worst, most people in that age group just don't understand what happened.


So lets legalize abortion because some kids in Poland are retards. Great Idea. Where do I sign.
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#189 User is offline   Madam Corvax Icon

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Posted 31 October 2006 - 11:08 AM

QUOTE (Sailor Abbey @ Oct 31 2006, 07:58 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I bet the crime rate in NY would plummet if we were aloud to pick of all the baddies before they did anything else wrong.

laugh.gif Well, of course it would! If we pick off all the baddies, only stock-brokers, doctors, plumbers and such like are left, and the probablility of them commiting crimes are not very high, are they. Looks like you missed the point, again. Anyway, allowed, not aloud.

Also - would you be so pro-human life if you were raped and forced bear the child yourself? OK, maybe you would, but it always simply leaves me speechles when somebody shows such attitude - the moral righteousness virtually blinding all empathy. Maybe you are so morally corageous to bear a child from rape, or child who is deformed or a child which may kill you or leave you so ill you cannot take care of it, but why force your moral point of view of others, who are perhaps not so brave?
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#190 User is offline   Sailor Abbey Icon

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Posted 31 October 2006 - 11:21 AM

QUOTE (Madam Corvax @ Oct 31 2006, 11:08 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
laugh.gif Well, of course it would! If we pick off all the baddies, only stock-brokers, doctors, plumbers and such like are left, and the probablility of them commiting crimes are not very high, are they. Looks like you missed the point, again. Anyway, allowed, not aloud.



As long as homo sapiens roam the planet there will always be crime, no matter how many babies you kill.

QUOTE (Madam Corvax @ Oct 31 2006, 11:08 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Also - would you be so pro-human life if you were raped and forced bear the child yourself? OK, maybe you would, but it always simply leaves me speechles when somebody shows such attitude - the moral righteousness virtually blinding all empathy. Maybe you are so morally corageous to bear a child from rape, or child who is deformed or a child which may kill you or leave you so ill you cannot take care of it, but why force your moral point of view of others, who are perhaps not so brave?


Actually, I’m not really that pro-human life. I am pro-CallingItWhatItIs. I think killing human beings is necessary at times. I am not a humanitarian in any sense of the word. I gleefully await the day when the population of the planet is drastically reduced by the next ice age or super volcano. I have been in a position where I considered an abortion. I know what its like to be pregnant and terrified. But I did not for one minute try and convince myself I would be doing anything less than terminating a human life. Incidentally, I ended up miscarrying but I think I would have ended up having it had I not. I’m not a quitter by nature… unless it comes to video games or math problems.


QUOTE (Madam Corvax @ Oct 31 2006, 11:08 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Maybe you are so morally corageous to bear a child from rape, or child who is deformed or a child which may kill you or leave you so ill you cannot take care of it, but why force your moral point of view of others, who are perhaps not so brave?


Being a pussy is a shabby excuse to kill somebody.
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#191 User is offline   barend Icon

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Posted 31 October 2006 - 06:57 PM

QUOTE (Sailor Abbey @ Oct 31 2006, 11:21 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Being a pussy is a shabby excuse to kill somebody.


and having one, even less.... tongue.gif
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