[Sailor Abbey]

I’m a pretty big Kill Bill fan, and I am not ashamed to say I have watched both volumes at least a dozen or so times each. Any movie where blood spurts vehemently out of a neck for at least 15 seconds , is worth watching at least twice.

In vol 2, Uma is instructed to go to a rack, pick out a sword and attack Pai Mei. After she pulls it out, she takes a few steps, looks at Pai Mei, and procedes to whip her sword around in a manner which I have come to refer to as: The Uma-Sword-Move-Thing.

Now, I am by no means a martial art expert, but I’d be willing to bet that this is some sort of actual Kung Fu stance or something. I have never actually seen anybody in a movie do it before Uma in Kill Bill vol. 2.

That having been said, I saw Obi-Wan do it at least once every time he whipped out his lightsaber to fight someone - most notably just before the Kenobi/Grevious pissing contest. Why in gods name would Obi-wan be doing such an obvious Kung Fu move that was obviously stolen directly from the very popular and much better movie that just happened to come out whilst ROTS was being made. Did George think that people wouldn’t notice he ripped it off? Did anybody else notice or was it just me? Its not like he jacked it from some old ass kung fu movie from the 70s - he stole it straight out of a movie that came out within 2 years of his. WTF.

W! T! F!

Will no one hold GL accountable for plagiarism?

[jariten]

Will no one hold GL accountable for plagiarism?

I saw this film the other day, called Star Wars or something. It was alright but anyway, LOL! you should have seen how the director ripped off other films SO BAD ROFL111!! I couldn't believe it!!! first there were whole ideas ripped right out of that japanese guys films U KNOW!!!!! Like those 2 robots and how that mercenary who doesnt care about others comes back in the nick of time to help out JUTS LIK THAT SOLO GUY!!! WTF!!! and then there was all that dogfight stuff thatsa the SAM as that war film the dambusters or something!!!LOL!!! and the whole thring was just like those crappy flash gordon serials from the 50s!!! man this ones gonna tank its soooo bad!!!ROFL!!!

Will nooen hold him accountable for plagarism??!!

W! T! F!

(that stands for What The Fuck, BTW)

[Sailor Abbey]

yeah but like I said - that other shit was stolen from movies that had come out some time before -

kill bill vol 2 was too close for it to be acceptable to steal from - not that its ever really ok.

Plus I really liked Kill Bill and I felt like GL had personally broken into my underwear drawer and stolen a pair of my panties, handed ‘em to Obi-wan and said “hey, swing these around every time your gonna fight someone, will ya?!”

"W! T! F!"

Its much more dramatic when you just type the first letter in caps.

[Laughlyn]

Play nice Jariten. I swear, you're becoming worse than JYAMG.

Kung-fu's Kung-fu. Virtually all styles rely on on fixed moves, you can't go blaming people for using the same moves. In this case we can't blame Lucas at all, since he's not the fight choreographer. Nick Gillard is.

As for one move being lifted, are you absolutely sure that it's never been in another movie? one of Arika Kurosawa's perhaps? - GL's inspiration for the artistic direction of the Lightsaber battles.....

[jariten]

yeah but like I said - that other shit was stolen from movies that had come out some time before -

And? It's still plagiarism though, right? Or is artistic theft acceptable because its from something thats came out "some time before"?

not that its ever really ok.

So...if you agree that artisitic theft is not ok, and you agree that its been part and parcel of SW since the beginning, what on earth are you trying to argue?

I'm all for a "Lets string Lucas up for plagiarism!" thread, sounds like fun. Meet you in the 'New Hope' forum then?

This post has been edited by jariten: 14 January 2006 - 10:18 PM

[Despondent]

Lucas' core audience probably hadn't seen KB yet, and that was a safe bet on his part.

Still, the more blatant in-your (fan's)-face method is Lucas' style....

[jariten]

Play nice Jariten. I swear, you're becoming worse than JYAMG.

Perhaps theres a limit on how many times I can hear the same arguments rolled out before...

But that wasn't a very kind response on my part, esp. towards a newcomer. Accurate maybe, but not too kind.

Apologies all round.

[Sailor Abbey]

And? It's still plagiarism though, right? Or is artistic theft acceptable because its from something thats came out "some time before"?
So...if you agree that artisitic theft is not ok, and you agree that its been part and parcel of SW since the beginning, what on earth are you trying to argue?

I let it slide before - but I will refer you to the - feels like he stole my panties quote. I personally feel violated because of the kill bill move.

yeah I figured this stuffs been talked about over and over again. I tried to appologize in advance. You'll have to cut me some slack.

are you absolutely sure that it's never been in another movie? one of Arika Kurosawa's perhaps? - GL's inspiration for the artistic direction of the Lightsaber battles.....

absolutely not - all I know is I have never seen it done before - guaranteed its been done many times before - I just thought it was even a little too obvious for Lucas.

I guess I was mistaken

[Laughlyn]

As I said, it's not Lucas, it's NICK GILLARD. He does the fights, and the moves, GL just does the shots.

Perhaps theres a limit on how many times I can hear the same arguments rolled out before...

You're not alone, I just stay out of it unless they get really stupid.

What do you call someone who bashes bashers anyhow?

EDIT:-Didn't want to double post.

This post has been edited by Laughlyn: 14 January 2006 - 10:31 PM

[Sailor Abbey]

As I said, it's not Lucas, it's NICK GILLARD. He does the fights, and the moves, GL just does the shots.

Weeeeeell... I still think somebody has to take responsibility... and if Lucas is going to go around saying that they're his movies - then they're his fight sceens too

[Laughlyn]

Take responsibility for what? A sword move? There's a limited number of ways to swing a sword. If someone dug up that move\shot in another earlier Kung-fu flick, QT would be credited for 'referencing' it.

Now if Lucas had written a scene where Obi-wan goes into a bar, cuts someones arm off, breakdance-carves up a bunch of saber weilding battle droids, and then fights a little girl with a ball and chain; it'd be different.

.....But he didn't, instead we have a possible similarity between 2 films, both of which contain sword fights of asian fighting styles.

[Sailor Abbey]

Asian? I thought this all happened a long time ago in a galaxy... well somewhere else

[Laughlyn]

Maybe so, but it was filmed in the present.

[civilian_number_two]

Gotta call this one a tie. KILL BILL is rife with referneces to Tarantino's favorite Shaw Brothers kung fu films, as well as ripoffs from fairly recent Miike Takashi images. Tarantino quotes the stuff without noting credit, most of the time. He figures it's obvious to the folks who know it, and to the other folks, well what the hell.

Lucas ripped off a bunch of stuff in STAR WARS with the same reasoning.

As for any ripoffs in the prequels, Lucas is still ripping off movies he watched in college. Only instead of crediting his film and cheeseball scifi sources, he claims to have woven a mythic tapestry borrowing heavily from the classics. Since it's easy to see the film references, and all the 'classic" analogies are stretches even after the most charitable defence, Lucas is just a big fat liar. Again I will remind everyone of how Tori Amos used to creidt Kate Bush as an inspiration, until one day Kate Bush stopped recording albums to settle down and raise children. Tori stopped with the crediting, making up bullshit inspiration like "Elton John" to avoid letting on she hasn't any individuality. Kate Bush recently put out a new album, triumphantly kicking Tori Amos in her non-creative ass. Whoo hoo!

So, 1 for Jariten for pointing out Lucas was always a ripoff artist, and an extra point for Tarantino doing the same thing, even if Jariten didn't call him on it. 2 points also to Sailor Abbey, point or no point, just because when called on it Tarantion will cite his references at length. Ask Lucas about the Lensmen series, and he'll laugh and start talking about The Iliad and Joseph Campbell.

[Darth Player]

I think Tarantino caters to a lot of us who grew up when VCRs first became a household item, and we saw a lot of dreck from the video store, because multiple copies of popular titles were scarce because movies cost more and we had to rent something. He's trying to have fun with stuff we saw, being a video clerk himself, with a vast knowledge of lots of movies, the suitcase in Pulp Fiction with the glow being similar to the one in Repo Man that vaporized all who opened it. Tarantino has a direction, and is creative, Lucas is just a thief.

And how cool would it have been for Mace Windu to say Palpatine had to get in the trunk of his Jedi starfighter with a shotgun to pop Yoda, only to go around the block and get his brains blown out a la Jackie Brown? tarantino seems t have a genuine love for film and its history, Lucas appears to have nothing but contempt for it.

Maybe the same fighting coach was hired for both films, which would explain things. Lucas lifted a lot from Lord Of The Rings, odd, since he supposedly had this great "vision" that the technology at the time was preventing from getting onto the screen.