[jariten]

Last night was the first time I’ve seen AOTC since ROTS came out, and I was surprised about how much I enjoyed it. Firstly, I was taken aback by just how dark and melancholy the whole thing is. After seeing the total picture, theres a brilliant sense of coming doom that runs up the spine of the narrative, the feeling that events are overtaking the Jedi, events that they’re powerless to stop.
OK, so the crap bits are still crap. These are largely confined to A and A’s love scenes, but now even these occasionally flicker with a great “No, don’t do it!” sense of unease.

What were rudimentary scenes before are now loaded with potent, esp. the introduction of the clones and the line “They are totally obedient, taking any order without question”. Infact, whereas I originally saw Obi’s plot line as a fun throwback to 40’s film noir detective series (which it undoubtedly is), now I can’t watch it without thinking that the whole operation is going to end with Order 66.
It was almost like watching it for the first time again. Anakins doomed attempt to rescue his mother made the character sympathetic in ways that I don’t remember from previous viewings. You know, the kid really can’t let go (even after the advice his mother gave him in TPM), but this makes him (unlike a lot of the Jedi) human. The end battles are still a blast, and I imagine they would lead quite well into the OSP of ROTS if watched in order.

Now, I’ve always liked this film, just that last nights viewing was the most fun I’ve had with the film since opening night summer 2002.

[Revan-47]

Jariten, you rock my face off. Although im probably the only one on this site that doesnt have a problem with the love scenes.

THink about it. They are both falling in love, what else would someone say to the other if you knew that it was illegal to marry. yud say that it would destroy both of you. it would ruin your lives and it would be hard to keep such a thing a secret. the reason the kiss hurt so bad was because she liked it so much but knew that she shouldnt fall in love. He was surprised and yet acting sarcastic when he asked"you love me?" after such a horrible conversation with padme, and then she says she loves him, that would be really confusing. They had great bonding scenes. when they were running around in the field, that was great(even though we could have done with out that weird pig). but seeing anakin roll over laughing brought a warm sense of humanity to me. the talks they had on the passenger ship were good. anakin was trying to find a loophole so that he could be with the woman he loved so much. that was also symbolic of what the jedi order should be; recognizing love as not something forbidden, but something necessary for life. My favorite love scene was the dinner scene. Him using the force and feeding her was just great. YOu can argue about how that is corny, but i ask the ladies on this site. if your boyfriend cut an apple and put the slice in your mouth, at a sunset dinner, would that not be romantic?

This post has been edited by Revan-47: 13 October 2005 - 11:49 AM

[Dorothy]

No, it would be creepy.

[Despondent]

Well I'm glad.

The whole Jedi's secretly/knowingly/dook-who? create the clones so that one day they'll all be killed by the clones is not satisfying to this OT fan, anyway.

Think about it: Jango couldn't kill Jedi (obi-wan) so OF COURSE x-number Jango clones could kill x-number Jedi by surprise attack. Maybe if they were the pompous jedi council of ep 1 and 2, but Order 66 was under battle conditions. And don't tell me it was a brilliant surprise execution. First thing Ben taught Luke was to close your eyes and be prepared to swing at unseen danger. Oh right- that's the OT.

[DarthTherion]

First thing Ben taught Luke was to close your eyes and be prepared to swing at unseen danger. Oh right- that's the OT.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Maybe this is where "the darkside clouds everything" and the concept of fate plays a role. The Jedi could not sense the attack coming because the Force essentially abandoned them -- as part of the balancing act in response to the restrictions the council had placed upon Force users.

I don't have time to develop this idea now, but...more to come!

[Zatoichi]

I didn't really feel like posting this, but I always like the idea of Vader hunting down and destroying much better. (Now, most of it just takes place in the EU)

[jariten]

the talks they had on the passenger ship were good. anakin was trying to find a loophole so that he could be with the woman he loved so much

I liked that scene too, for exactly the same reason. Overall, I thought the ideas of the Ep2 love story (essentially a ‘forbidden romance’ story) were fine. It’s just the general execution I have a problem with. Not only the dialogue, but the stiff direction. Having said that, they were essential to the overall story, and its hard to watch them now without feeling a stab of anxiety.

And don't tell me it was a brilliant surprise execution. First thing Ben taught Luke was to close your eyes and be prepared to swing at unseen danger. Oh right- that's the OT.

Despondant, did you post in the wrong thread? Anyway, are you talking about that remote here? Y’know, the thing that Luke knew was there?

[Zatoichi]

Y’know, the thing that Luke knew was there?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ack, they knew the clone troops were "there". Besides, Luke wasn't a fully trained Jedi Knight or Master, only a Force-sensitive being.

Yeah I know they probably didn't see the attack from their own troops coming, but damn it could have been made to look like the Jedi tried to fight back. That, and the fact that in post-ROTS EU material, the clone troops were trained to be absolutely loyal to the Jedi generals. Now suddenly (or not quite, perhaps) they turn on them withou a care. It would have been cool for one of the commanders to argue with Palpatine and perhaps be killed by an inferior officer.

This post has been edited by Zatoichi: 13 October 2005 - 06:42 PM

[jariten]

We should try to keep this AOTC related. I can already see this turning into another boring back and forth.

[DarthTherion]

I have a funny feeling that even the "crap" parts of AOTC will one day be considered classic by fans, much in the same way that we embrace Luke's whining in ANH or the Nooooooo! in ESB.

Maybe I'm way off.

Hey, Jariten, I appreciate your comment that Anakin's inability to let go makes him human. It's ironic that this very quality eventually stamps out most of his humanity.

[Despondent]

I don't have time to develop this idea now, but...more to come!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well good, somebody needs to present it to the hungry audience in a palletable way. Luc-hiss didn't.

the chAOTiC film led us further down the darkside. Where OT fans despair and fear the worst.

And that WAS the sense that jump-started this webforum, God Bless it.

__

btw, the council being all clouded and not able to use the force is a joke. that's like showing up for work everyday and being fine with nothing getting ever produced. (fine: cite the Bush administration) Or going to see your favorite SF franchise again and again with less and less hope or expectation.

[Zatoichi]

Sorry jariten, we're just evil like that

[jariten]

Hey, Jariten, I appreciate your comment that Anakin's inability to let go makes him human

I think this was Lucas’ intention. To suggest that what the Jedi view as terrible flaws of character, we would look at and say, “well, maybe that’s what I would do too”.

Despondant, you’re making less and less sense every post you make. Could you take me through your last comment again please?

[Despondent]

Having to make up excuses to enjoy a film is laughable.

Fine, we'll keep it AOTC related. A finer point to the blade that is: the prequels suck.

Chefelf's Prequels suck lists led to this forum. A place where bashers belly up to the bar. There was a time we didn't allow your kind here by default.

the council in the clouds were as ineffective as Lucas' editors. Here's where I salute Civilian for not submitting to the drivel.


And "Despondent" has an E at the end.


You can't understand my posts yet you Defend Lucas' tripe and annotate for hours?

[jariten]

btw, the council being all clouded and not able to use the force is a joke. that's like showing up for work everyday and being fine with nothing getting ever produced.

You posted this. I can't figure out how this is a critique of, or even how it relates to the film we're talking about. I'm still surprised at peoples refusal to believe that the darkside was powerful enough to cloud the good (there was certainly enough talk of it in the films), or is it that people hate the idea that the Jedi weren't a group of invincible wizards?

and "your kind"? come on, you're better than that.

Despondant, you’re making less and less sense every post you make

Well, this wasn't meant to be insulting, but in hindsight, obviously a mistake on my part. Anyway, back to AOTC (?).