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The Big Secret If Anakin and Padme were found out...

#16 User is offline   julie123 Icon

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Posted 13 June 2005 - 12:49 PM

QUOTE (julie123 @ Jun 13 2005, 05:46 PM)
On the button.  He also wanted to show that Anakin would put his personal feelings and ego above the Jedi order. 

I still can't figure out however why Obi Wan, who lectured Anakin about his nasty thoughts for Padme and who also reminded Anakin that his duty was to the Jedi Order and not rescuing Padme when she fell of that ship in Attack of the Clones, why he allowed Anakin to escort Padme on his ownsome, at the end of the film.  For god's sake he SAW,


okay, didn't finish my point there, something spooky happening with my computer.
going to go on to say 'he SAW Padme embrace Anakin when she got to that hanger and still allowed those cuddly twosome to go off alone together. It's as if he WANTED Anakin to marry Padme in secret.
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#17 User is offline   barend Icon

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Posted 13 June 2005 - 09:10 PM

all these theories are fine....

but do you think maybe, lucas made the jedi celibates so that all the dateless geekazoids who put jedi down as their religion will feel like they're half way there...

hmmm? Just a thought....smile.gif
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#18 User is offline   Despondent Icon

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Posted 15 June 2005 - 06:22 PM

One thing I thought was dumb was when Padme says something like: "And what if they suppose you're the father?" Well, who else could it possibly be?

Oh. Maybe she sleeps around. Never mind.
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#19 User is offline   Trigormike Icon

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Posted 15 June 2005 - 06:26 PM

Another virgin birth courtesy of Palpatine/Plagus?
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#20 User is offline   barend Icon

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Posted 15 June 2005 - 07:34 PM

QUOTE (LiocModnar @ Jun 10 2005, 12:41 AM)
Love is energetically unfavourable, inefficient, and hazardous to your health.  With all the other occupational risks, I could see leaving that one out.


better to have the emotional instability brought on by long term lonliness?

QUOTE (LiocModnar @ Jun 10 2005, 12:41 AM)
Yes, blind they were.  On the other hand being in love is equally blinding.  Even Palpatine said as much.  Conclude no real advantage either way.


blinding to the point that you over look flaws in the one you love.

not: "that's guy's evil, i have to stop him... or i could go visit my girlfriend and snuggle."

QUOTE (LiocModnar @ Jun 10 2005, 12:41 AM)
They never said anything about sex being forbidden.  It's perfectly possible to have sex without personal attachment or love ever entering the picture.  For all we know, their temple's a swinging place.


even better... (as disturning the thought of yoda having sex is)

or istead of freeing shmi, qui-gon decided to leave his prositiute money alone to keep himself focused...
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#21 User is offline   JW Wells Icon

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Posted 16 June 2005 - 09:44 AM

Also, what's so awful about being expelled from the Jedi, anyhow? You already know how to use the force, you've had the years of training - sure, they might make you give up your lightsaber, but since Jedi learn how to make their own, it's just a minor setback.

You'd lose your paycheck, but Anakin's married to some serious money, and I could see there being a large, lucrative market for ex-Jedi as bounty hunters, mercenaries, bodyguards, security consultants, etc. Someone as powerful as we keep getting told Anakin is could probably set up his own, saner version of the Jedi order.

Why not accept expulsion, live openly with Padme, get some big ol' "director of security" gig from Palpatine or someone else, and leave everybody happier?
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#22 User is offline   Thracozaag Icon

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Posted 16 June 2005 - 10:12 AM

QUOTE (JW Wells @ Jun 16 2005, 09:44 AM)
Why not accept expulsion, live openly with Padme, get some big ol' "director of security" gig from Palpatine or someone else, and leave everybody happier?


*imagining Anakin in the standard navy blazer/maroon pants security uniform*

"Hey you kids! No landspeeders in the food court!!"

koji

This post has been edited by Thracozaag: 16 June 2005 - 10:14 AM

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#23 User is offline   Casual Fan Icon

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Posted 17 June 2005 - 02:45 PM

OK, I actually don't have a problem with the Jedi as a celibate order (either no sex but sex is OK but no marriage). The Jedi always struck me as somewhat Jesuit-like and there is a long history of celibate quasi-religious orders. And face it, the idea of the Force is a religion.

There are two reasons for orders such as the Jedi to be celibate. First, to focus all that energy on the objects of the order. Second, to avoid attachments, particularly marriage, that a member of the order might put above the order. And Anakin does fall pray to the second temptation. One point of the movies is that love of all mankind is better than love for a specific individual.

However, this is another case in these movies of a defensible concept, terrible execution. First, Anakin's way of putting Padme above the order he is a part of is to slaughter young children because he had a nightmare. Actually, you don't need more, but then there is the fact that the Jedi don't seem bothered by Anakin's relationship with Padme (except for one throwaway remark by Yoda in AOTC). Obi Wan actually knows and and seems to approve, and the others don't know and don't care to find out.

So Anakin's relationship with Padme brings him into conflict with the rest of the Jedi....not at all. That is not what is keeping him from the coveted title of Jedi Master, what is keeping him from that is the fact that he is a punk.
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#24 User is offline   Hari Seldon Icon

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Posted 17 June 2005 - 05:34 PM

QUOTE (Casual Fan @ Jun 17 2005, 07:45 PM)
(...) And face it, the idea of the Force is a religion.

There are two reasons for orders such as the Jedi to be celibate.  First, to focus all that energy on the objects of the order.  (...)


I think that, somewhat beatiful, concept was ruined by the midichlorian thing...

Focus on the energy? What energy?
If there were Jedi Olympics I bet there would be a lot of anti-doping controls for "midichlorian-improving-drugs".
Bah. Religion, my ass.

Nevermind... just pissed off at the whole thing.
"I prefer rationalism to atheism. The question of God and other objects-of-faith are outside reason and play no part in rationalism, thus you don't have to waste your time in either attacking or defending."

Isaac Asimov
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#25 User is offline   LiocModnar Icon

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Posted 21 June 2005 - 09:40 AM

QUOTE (barend @ Jun 15 2005, 07:34 PM)
better to have the emotional instability brought on by long term lonliness?

Anything can bring on emotional instability if a person has no control. Besides, there is some evidence that a life of independence contributes just as much to longevity as a life of marriage does. It depends on the temperament of the person.

QUOTE
blinding to the point that you over look flaws in the one you love.
not: "that's guy's evil, i have to stop him... or i could go visit my girlfriend and snuggle."

Oh really? A friend of mine recently put herself in the same stupid situation as Padme did - you're going to go away for a long time and probably come back dead? OK! Let's get married! Guess what she spends her time thinking about? And nothing else. Who needs to stop evil when your spouse spent the last 7 months halfway across the world/galaxy?

QUOTE
even better... (as disturning the thought of yoda having sex is)

Sex and love are independent entities. It's possible to forbid one and engage in the other.

QUOTE
or istead of freeing shmi, qui-gon decided to leave his prositiute money alone to keep himself focused...

Who said anything about paying for it? I highly doubt the cost of an hour with a prostitute would be equivalent to the cost of a person's lifetime. Furthermore, a male's sex drive peaks at 18. Qui-Gon was in his 60s I believe. I don't think it would take much to keep him entertained. Certainly not enough to buy Shmi.

Any emotional involvement hinders a person from doing their job. Only when entirely detached can a situation be assessed with any clarity. Cold? Absolutely. However, there's a reason not everybody makes it through the training program.
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#26 User is offline   Tpolg Icon

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Posted 21 June 2005 - 04:43 PM

This had to be the worst kept Secret in the galaxy.
Anakin blatantly takes R2 in to combat, and anyone calling on the distinguished senator from Naboo is greeted by C-3P0.

Palpatine knew, Organa probably knew, Yoda must have known, and Obi-Wan?
Anakin: What did Obi-Wan want?
Padmé: He is worried about you.
Anakin: So why did come here?

As to the “penalty” should they finely fess up?
I imagine, a mandatory sabbatical, after which, a fresh evaluation.

It is never fully explained what taboo exactly they are braking? Obviously Padawans are not supposed to merry (I think we can all agree on that) and any marriage that would create a conflict of interests, like oh say merreing a senator would not be approved of.
Padmé’s statement in AOTC “You are training to become a Jedi, I am a senator” would indicate that may be the primary problem.
So why did Padmé not just resign from the senate? I guess she thought the Republic needed her. Needed her to do what? Leave Jar Jar to plunge the Galaxy…..but I digress.
It must be presumed that at some point Jedi are allowed/encouraged to merry, since they are harvested from a specific gene pool, it is only equitable (and wise) to return some.
As for emotional attachment?
Obi-Wan: You are my brother Anakin!
The Master/Padawan relationship can be as intense as mirage, its what you do with it that can be a problem.

This post has been edited by Tpolg: 21 June 2005 - 04:49 PM

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#27 User is offline   barend Icon

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Posted 21 June 2005 - 09:25 PM

i don't think a single knight, paladin, soldier, or even member of an attacking barabaric horde fough to less than his potential because he had a wife at home...

the jedi being celibate is lame, even monks being celibate is lame... there is no biblical back-up for priests, nuns and monks to be celibate, it's just some warped bullshit that someone made up...

and look what it leeds to.... all sorts of depraved practices and activities...

depriving yourself of being gratified in one area of emotions in no way improves others...

you can't supress love anyway... if you meet that right person you will fall for them, and there is fuck all you can do about it. you can avoid that person, and just accept that nothing will come of it, but it wont cut down your distraction. if anything, giving in to those emotions and embracing the idea of a realationship will iliviate the tension that would come from it... it's how humans are...

and there is a severe lack of insight into human emotions all the way through this pathietic love story...
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#28 User is offline   THX-1138 Icon

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Posted 22 June 2005 - 12:55 PM

I doubt Anakin would have been expelled from the order, though he probably would have been punished. A good deal of the Jedi, including Obi Wan, were getting a little action on the side. Though the rule does have some bit of logic, I suppose, as if something happened to your loved one, you might not fight to full ability. Or, you might shout "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO" and destroy several droids and expensive medical tools.
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