[Grand Moff Lebowski]

I really like to give George the benefit of the doubt, but he F-ed me again. I really thought that he would show the origins of the suit Vader wears. As it stands now, it looks like the Emperor had this cool design just WAITING for a chance to build it onto someone. I thought perhaps it was a symbol of the Sith based on old scriptures or evil hieroglyphs. Lucas leaves us with NO explanation at all.

Now I can imagine several scenes where Vader's body is elevated up on the operating table and the Emperor says, "No, no, no! It's all wrong. I want it ALL black! With little silver bits by the mouth! And make the mouth more angular."
A sighing Vader is lowered back to horizontal as the droids begin design revisions.

And while we're on it....why even let on that Annie is Vader? Do we need to be beaten over the head with this? If, as Lucas says, this generation will see the episodes in the proper order (I-IV) why give it all away? Why not have Annie thrown in the lava and presumed dead with some mystery around his whereabouts? Say some probe droids fishing around the lava banks at the end of the film looking for...something? A mysterious message informing the Emperor that "We have found it"? One of the BIGGEST moments in movie history is, "I AM YOUR FATHER"!! Lucas has taken the impact away from it by giving this away too early AND by adding dialogue in the Special Editions that give it away at the beginning of Empire.

What a dufus. Sometimes I tink it's a bad F-ing dream.....

This post has been edited by Grand Moff Lebowski: 06 June 2005 - 08:16 PM

[barend]

it just shows that the dudes who made KOTOR 1 would have been a much better bunch of hands in which to leave this project...

[floppydisk]

I agree with Lebowski. I was thinking "Jeez, did the emporer just have a spare one of these lying around?"

[Despondent]

Yep. Hayden's the far away galaxy version of the Brady Bunch's "Johnny Bravo."

[CowboyCurtis]

Yeah, exactly on the nose, Lebowski!!

That's the thing there is no precedents for the Vader outfit! If anything, given PT-universe, Vader should've looked more like Greivous, right? I mean, just compare the technology! Vader could've had four splitting arms, right? He could've had all neat devices to crawl on the outside of ships and jump around like a spider, eh?

[fett]

Yeah, exactly on the nose, Lebowski!!

That's the thing there is no precedents for the Vader outfit!  If anything, given PT-universe, Vader should've looked more like Greivous, right?  I mean, just compare the technology!  Vader could've had four splitting arms, right?  He could've had all neat devices to crawl on the outside of ships and jump around like a spider, eh?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

George Lucas Say: When money is at stake, logic is unimportant and secondary.

[Dark_Sith]

I'm going to have to agree with you guys on this one. I can't argue that. I have no idea where Vader's suit came from, it's like it came out of no where, and as someone said before, like Sidious had it lying aroundw waiting for someone to get burned to hell like Anakin did in ROTS.

[floppydisk]

Palpatine: "Hey, perfect! I was looking for a use for this suit!"

[julie123]

it's always nice to have a spare suit handy!

my beef though, is why does Anakin learn so damn quickly to walk on those legs of his? wouldn't it take him a little longer, different galazy and use of force aside?

another thing, why the hell don't they just clone him some lungs, legs etc. why does Vader/Anakin get to stay in that suit all those years when they could have just cloned him a new body?

It doesn't make any SENSE!!!

[Private Zod]

We all know damn well, that if there was any foreshadowing in the first two films of anything even close to resembling a Vader suit, we would have gone nuts about the "Blatant Foreshadowing" like we did for the Death Star, Greedo reference, Boba Fett, etc.

[Grand Moff Lebowski]

We all know damn well, that if there was any foreshadowing in the first two films of anything even close to resembling a Vader suit, we would have gone nuts about the "Blatant Foreshadowing" like we did for the Death Star, Greedo reference, Boba Fett, etc.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Good Lord, you couldn't be more wrong.

Pathetic.

[Private Zod]

Good Lord, you couldn't be more wrong.

Pathetic.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Easy cowboy. Let's not bust a gasket over this.

Explain why I am so off base. I won't argue that if Grievous appeared more like a V1 of Vader, that could work. However, I have seen alot on this board (rightly so as well) that anything that even resembled foreshadowing of things in the OT was blasted as pandering to the lowest and easiest denominator.

This post has been edited by Private Zod: 07 June 2005 - 06:15 PM

[Grand Moff Lebowski]

I don't know what you are referring to.

And there'll be no gaskets or head pipes blown over anything here....errr...cow..girl?

I can't believe you need further explanation on this.

[Jordan]

I'm willing to assume they had one laying around. It's not asking too much of me.

The reconstruction scene was one of the few I actually enjoyed. (very few I actually enjoyed)

One of the BIGGEST moments in movie history is, "I AM YOUR FATHER"!!

True. However, save a few souls (civillian and perhaps despondent) how many people do you know that watched the films in proper order AND knew absolutley nothing about the story.

SW is such pop culture that every one, wether they've seen the movies or not, know that some guy named Vader is the father of another guy named Luke.

Perhaps you got lucky and avoided every single spoiler, most of them popping up in other films as humor (space balls), but I didn't and I don't know one pal who managed that.

Civllian is always griping about how lame SW has become because he was around since day one. He saw the actual evolution of the film. It's interesting to read his take on the OT. Go back and view older threads.

Little things that younger generations would have not considered

The Luke telepathic message to Leia

-When I saw this film I already knew leia was the sister, so I did not find this bizzare.

Civillian quote

Luke "thought calls" to Leias and she receives it. Yes; I saw the movie when I was twelve years old. Thing is, this CAN'T be a clue that she is the "other" foretold by Yoda, since neither Leia nor Luke think it's even the least bit odd that they can do this.

Consider this: You're watching a movie, and then a character does a completely absurd thing, like send a thought across space to another person, and the other person receives it. You figure this is a big deal, and that it deserves some explanation. Then, nowhere in the movie is it ever explained or even questioned by any character. Luke doesn't think it's odd that Leia can hear his thoughts. He never suspects that she may be Force-sensitive, or his sister, or another Jedi knight. SO... you, the viewer, are made to revise your opinion. You have to figure that maybe there was nothing unusual about this at all. When Luke learned this trick, he must have learned that it was a thing Jedi could do. Leia, being royalty and well-read, probably knew this was something Jedi could do. So when they don't even question the event, you figure it had to be something that is possible in their universe. Not exactly mundane, but not unique, either. the chracters all but tell you "don't worry about this; it's not unusual."

Now: the sequel comes along, and someone says "Well, you should have known that Leia was something special; remember how she could hear Luke's thoughts?" You gotta feel cheated. I know I did, and I was only a teenager. Sure, I said, it seemed unusual to me at first, but when the characters went along with it ... ah, fuck you, Lucas! You're making this up as you go along! If it was such a big fucking clue, then Luke and Leia should have suspected something, you hack!

Watching the Saga out of order helps explain many blunders or loose ends that Lucas pulls out of his hat, like the leia call.

So if you watch the films out of order with foreknowledge of what happens next, the film is actually easier to swallow,Cool huh?

So I agree with you that Vader being the dad was HUGE, probably the biggest thing in the entire saga, but everybody on planet earth already knows about it. So the PT did not spoil it. The PT ruined it with poor story and plot that's all.

This post has been edited by Jordan: 07 June 2005 - 06:52 PM

[Mnesymone]

One of the things about the Darth Vader suit in the OT was the universal themes - the loyalist soldiers on the blockade runner wore a helmet flared similar to vaders over-helm, the Death Star gunners, the Navy troopers, then the TIE pilots and AT-AT drivers wore something akin to Vader's underhelm, while the AT-ST drivers wore a flared helmet again. I kind of assumed it was a universal Imperial theme (even the stormtrooper helmets bear considerable resemblance to Vader's underhelm) except for the snowtroopers and the Imperial Guard who had their own separate design theme - also, since the Rebels used the flared helmets, I assumed it was based of a common republican theme that had been adopted and altered by both the Rebellion and the Empire.
Instead, we see that Vader's gear was personalised around him based on designs Sidious may have knocked up recently.