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General Yoda

#1 User is offline   diligent_d Icon

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Posted 17 May 2005 - 01:06 AM

Another thing pisses me off (I'm on a roll tonight) is during the end battle in Attack Of The Clones, why were the Clone Troops listening to Yoda when he was ordering the clone troops around: "More battalions to the left. Encircle them we must, then divide." Blah, blah.

Yeah, ok General Yoda...when did he become a military authority or a tactician?

"Wars do not make one great." Hmm, I guess they did that day.

It's a small nitpick, but one that's always stuck with me.
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#2 User is offline   StarWarsIsUs Icon

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Posted 17 May 2005 - 07:15 AM

No, it's a large nitpick, and a large mess-up in the movie. Yoda most definatly was not the one to command troops around, since it does not fit his reserved character as a Jedi Master.
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#3 User is offline   Helena Icon

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Posted 17 May 2005 - 10:09 AM

Come to that, when did Obi-Wan become a military authority or tactician? I suppose he may have demonstrated exceptional talent, but even so, two years is a pretty short time for someone with no previous military experience to become a General.
QUOTE
The sandpeople had women and children. We know this because Anakin killed them how could he tell? The children might be smaller but I never saw a sandperson with breasts. Did they hike their skirts and show him some leg or something?

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Also, I can see the point of wanting to kidnap a human and use her as a slave, but they didn't. They tied her to a flimsy easel for a month. It's assumed they had to feed and give her water. What for? Was she purely ornamental? I can understand them wanting the droids, you can sell those for a lot of money, but a chick who's only skills are finding non-existand mushrooms and getting randomly pregnant, you're not going to get much.

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#4 User is offline   Lord Melkor Icon

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Posted 17 May 2005 - 10:12 AM

Aren`t most Jedi generals because Old Republic lacked a professional cadre of officers?
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#5 User is offline   Dark_Sith Icon

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Posted 17 May 2005 - 10:33 AM

The Jedi's became Generals because the Clone Army was BUILT FOR THEM. Who else would you put as Generals? I mean come on, it's common sense people. You can't give the clones ranks, because I know people here would be pissed off and complain just like the Droids have ranks. Just get over it. Jedi's became Generals because the Clone Army was made for them and the Republic.

Also, this isn't a large nitpick, this is quite small. AS it's common sense really to know why the Jedi's became Generals.

This post has been edited by Dark_Sith: 17 May 2005 - 10:33 AM

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#6 User is offline   Lord Aquaman Icon

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Posted 17 May 2005 - 11:02 AM

I guess it's just part of the Star Wars running gag for individuals with no real military experience to get the General rank off the bat - Han, Lando, even that bastard CGI monster Jar Jar...

Next we'll see General C-3P0 and Colonel R2-D2. Or should that be the other way around?
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#7 User is offline   civilian_number_two Icon

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Posted 17 May 2005 - 01:35 PM

Clones aren't robots. They are people. Some of them could have been officers. It's in the training, and in the prenatal conditioning. For kicks, read BRAVE NEW WORLD. It's not science, but it's a reasonable bit of fiction that (essentially) has clones in it.
"I had a lot of different ideas. At one point, Luke, Leia and Ben were all going to be little people, and we did screen tests to see if we could do that." -George Lucas, in STAR WARS: the Annotated Screenplays (p197).
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#8 User is offline   Lord Melkor Icon

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Posted 17 May 2005 - 01:49 PM

Oh and Jedi have skills to be good commanders, even if fighting isn`t their purpose!
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Posted 17 May 2005 - 01:51 PM

the republic had no army, therefore no generals. the clones could be generals but they have no experience, they are only ten yrs old for goodness' sake! the jedi are not soldiers, nor are they philosophers; they are both, they are warriors. who better to lead the army?
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#10 User is offline   Helena Icon

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Posted 17 May 2005 - 02:03 PM

QUOTE (Dark_Sith @ May 17 2005, 04:33 PM)
The Jedi's became Generals because the Clone Army was BUILT FOR THEM. Who else would you put as Generals? I mean come on, it's common sense people. You can't give the clones ranks, because I know people here would be pissed off and complain just like the Droids have ranks. Just get over it. Jedi's became Generals because the Clone Army was made for them and the Republic.

  Also, this isn't a large nitpick, this is quite small. AS it's common sense really to know why the Jedi's became Generals.

I'm sorry - it's 'common sense' to put someone with no military experience, tactical knowledge, or proven leadership abilities in charge of a whole army? Well, all I can say is that I'm bloody glad our own military leaders don't subscribe to that kind of 'common sense'. Yoda actually says himself that the Jedi are not soldiers - being able to wave a lightsaber around does not automatically mean you'll have the skills necessary for directing troop movements or leading others into battle.

What should have happened is that the Republic had its own army, with its own cadre of officers. It's not impossible that the Jedi could have served under them in past conflicts, and that some of them could have been promoted to positions of authority - which would explain Obi-Wan becoming a General. But of course, Lucas chose instead to throw all logic out of the window and make every Tom, Dick, Harry or Jar Jar into a military leader.
QUOTE
The sandpeople had women and children. We know this because Anakin killed them how could he tell? The children might be smaller but I never saw a sandperson with breasts. Did they hike their skirts and show him some leg or something?

QUOTE
Also, I can see the point of wanting to kidnap a human and use her as a slave, but they didn't. They tied her to a flimsy easel for a month. It's assumed they had to feed and give her water. What for? Was she purely ornamental? I can understand them wanting the droids, you can sell those for a lot of money, but a chick who's only skills are finding non-existand mushrooms and getting randomly pregnant, you're not going to get much.

- J m HofMarN on the Sand People
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#11 User is offline   Chefelf Icon

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Posted 17 May 2005 - 03:42 PM

QUOTE (Dark_Sith @ May 17 2005, 10:33 AM)
I mean come on, it's common sense people. You can't give the clones ranks, because I know people here would be pissed off and complain just like the Droids have ranks.


The clones, like the droids, do have a ranking system. There are even elite units.

It is tradition in the Star Wars universe for people to become Generals for no particular reason other than being the stars of the movies. Han Solo, Luke Skywalker, Lando Calrissian, Jar Jar Binks, Obi-Wan Kenobi, etc.
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#12 User is offline   StarWarsIsUs Icon

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Posted 17 May 2005 - 04:37 PM

The generals in which we are referring to, is not a real flaw in the movie. It is just PART of the movie. There is nothing we can argue against it, because it doesn't destroy continuity with the OT. So I say to someone who wants to sit and blab about it being STUPID, then they are also insulting the OT. Just as Chef said, it is tradition.
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#13 User is offline   Helena Icon

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Posted 18 May 2005 - 09:50 AM

QUOTE (StarWarsIsUs @ May 17 2005, 10:37 PM)
The generals in which we are referring to, is not a real flaw in the movie. It is just PART of the movie. There is nothing we can argue against it, because it doesn't destroy continuity with the OT. So I say to someone who wants to sit and blab about it being STUPID, then they are also insulting the OT. Just as Chef said, it is tradition.

It's just as STUPID in the OT as it is in the PT, but at least it doesn't happen quite as often. If I remember correctly, Luke was a Commander by RotJ and Han was a Captain. Lando was made a General, but at least they'd been fighting for quite a while by then and some reason was given for it.
QUOTE
The sandpeople had women and children. We know this because Anakin killed them how could he tell? The children might be smaller but I never saw a sandperson with breasts. Did they hike their skirts and show him some leg or something?

QUOTE
Also, I can see the point of wanting to kidnap a human and use her as a slave, but they didn't. They tied her to a flimsy easel for a month. It's assumed they had to feed and give her water. What for? Was she purely ornamental? I can understand them wanting the droids, you can sell those for a lot of money, but a chick who's only skills are finding non-existand mushrooms and getting randomly pregnant, you're not going to get much.

- J m HofMarN on the Sand People
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#14 User is offline   Bohrok Awakener Icon

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Posted 18 May 2005 - 03:17 PM

I agree that Yoda shouldn't have led the troops. I can sort of understand Jedi Knights leading groups of clones against an enemy (like in ROTS), but Yoda was like the clone's leader... Yoda has not fought in any wars, since the last war before the Clones Wars was at least 1000 years ago, and Yoda is *only* 800 and something. He should not know about planning an army strategy. He just shouldn't.

I would have preferred to have had Mace Windu leading the troops (since he seems more like a warrior). Heck, even little Boba Fett would know more about battle tactics than Yoda. Yoda is a wise old Jedi Master, who spends his days training little kids to trust their feelings. He might have been a warrior in the past, but he just doesn't make a good general.
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#15 User is offline   JW Wells Icon

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Posted 19 May 2005 - 09:51 AM

Rapid promotion in wartime is not unusual - George Armstrong Custer went from Captain to Major General in about three years during the Civil War, and some of Napoleon's marshals went from private to general in under ten years. If the Republic had to build an officer corps out of whole cloth, they'd likely promote anyone with real talent very rapidly indeed.

It's harder to believe that the officers would all be Jedi, as their training doesn't seem to prepare them for military command any better than other paramilitary forces, and it's hard to see Yoda as Supreme Commander. He's old, there's no evidence he's studied the skillset required for command, and he has extensive experience with the Jedi, which seem like a loosely organized militant order rather than an army. "General Kenobi", on the other hand, seems perfectly reasonable.
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