[Storm]

1. Luke could see Bespin, and feel the pain of his friends, because he had a bond with them, he's been with them for years. Even though Luke is Vader's son, Vader had only one brief encounter with the boy, so how in the world would he be able to detect him or his friends from across the galaxy?

Well said. That would be my explanation as well.

2. This is something that doesn't matter in the slightest. Luke's X-wing had a hyperdrive, even if some of the fleet remained over Hoth, I have no doubt that he could evade them long enough to escape. Having him escape the fleet as Han did would add un-needed screen time to the film.

Although I do agree that it would be unecessary footage, I just can't help but wonder where the fleet is when Luke is leaving the planet.

3. The Falcon is the same color as the star destroyer. The Star Destroyer is huge. Finding the Falcon is like finding a needle in a haystack. The Star Destroyer probably has very few windows outside of the bridge. And I'm sure Han knew where the placements of those windows were. It's a strech, but I feel that it works.

That's fine, but I still find it impossible to believe that Falcon went from zooming past the bridge to landing on the back of the control tower in less than 4 seconds.

5.  They get there faster because they have hyperdrives. Remember, Han says Bespin is a ways off.

That is true. But Boba Fett would have needed to follow the Falcon for a long ways in order to actually figure out where they were going. My explanation would be that as soon as Boba discovered they were in the garbage he contacted Darth Vader, and had the Executor follow closely behind. Once it was apparent that the only planet they would be capable of making it to was Bespin (through some process of deduction), then they would have gone into hyperspace and beat them there.

7. Luke's X-wing is built to withstand the brutality of space, I think it can handle a crash into water.

Fair enough.

8. I have no idea waht you are referring to, so I cannot explain it. Inconsistancies often happen in all movies during fight scenes, I do not let them bother me.

Okay, I'll try to explain the scene more clearly. Luke and Vader begin fighting, but Vader uses the Force to start throwing objects at Luke. Eventually he sends some large object at him which hits the glass causing everything to fly out into the bottomless pit. We see Luke fly out the window, and Vader walks over to see what happened to Luke. From his viewpoint, Luke is climbing back up into the room. Once Luke finishes climbing, he lays on the ground and we can see that underneath the grate he is lying on there was absolutely nothing for him to have grabbed onto.

A kooky milennium falcon maneuver I'll buy a lot sooner than I will a clearly superior Count Dooku running away when he should have just bushwhacked Yoda while the bastard was vulnerable doing the un-Zen maneuver of directly lifting a heavy piece of masonry.

Yes, I have often wondered why Dooku didn't cut Yoda's head off while he was attempting to saving Anakin and Obi-Wan. That would have been the funniest scene in the entire Star Wars saga. Perhaps it was just respect for his old master that he would let him live.

Hrm, I guess that does it for the heroes. We watched them go through their trials and here they are, on the floor and out for the count (no pun intended). What a waste of my time!

I enjoyed the those three sets of duels at the end of AOTC for a few reasons.

1. Earlier in the movie Yoda makes note of how young and old Jedi are so sure of their abilities. Obi-Wan and Anakin getting their asses kicked by Dooku should be enough motivation for them to reconsider their abilities. I thoroughly enjoyed seeing the two of them half dead on the floor while Dooku just looks at them seemingly disappointed with how futile their dueling was.

2. Although Yoda is flipping and jumping around like crazy, he fails to ever gain any advantage in the duel. Dooku easily could have killed Yoda (I'm unsure of why he doesn't), and some may see this as an indication that none of the Jedi are any match for the Sith. It's also hilarious to see Christopher Lee, who was 80 years old when the movie was released, begin his battle with Yoda by doing a triple flip in the air. How many 80 year olds do you know that can do a triple flip in the air like that?

This post has been edited by Storm: 16 May 2005 - 04:51 PM

[snaithbert]

I said ESB is one of my favorite movies.  However, it does have small tidbits that make absolutely no sense. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I wonder why it is that no one ever bothered discussing the OT's "small tidbits" BEFORE the new movies came out?

To me it sounds like you're basically trying to use the minor flaws of the OT to excuse the major flaws of the PT. So just because the OT had a few flaws, that means we should overlook the MANY flaws of the PT? Do two wrongs make a right?

In any case you gotta get with the program, chumley. The OT may have had a few hiccups here and there, but the PT just out and out sucks. There's nothing redeemable about the PT, except maybe for the fact that it's finally over.

What is ACTUALLY hilarious is how some people on these forums are incapable of formulating their own opinion without first consulting with Chef Elf.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's just a totally unrelated and stupid point. It's like you're trying to start a fight.

To quote my good friend Porkins- stay on target.

Actually Porkins may not have said that, but you know what I mean.

[StarWarsIsUs]

Maybe you are the one trying to start the fight. Ever think of that, Snaith?

[snaithbert]

Maybe you are the one trying to start the fight. Ever think of that, Snaith?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ah but I promise you, I am not.

I don't like to fight, believe me.

It's just that when someone ends their post with an unrelated addition about how we're all mindless sheep just trying to please Chef Elf- it ticks me off.

His post was about the flaws in the OT, but he couldn't resist tossing in a little cutie about how we're just kissing up, etc.

And that may (or may not) be true, but it was totally unrelated to the discussion at hand and basically intended to just shine us on.

I find stuff like that really annoying.

It's like he couldn't think of a good point for his arguement so he decided to just switch to an insult.

Most people on this board are better than that.

But I assure you I don't pick fights.

There's just no advantage to that.

[Storm]

To me it sounds like you're basically trying to use the minor flaws of the OT to excuse the major flaws of the PT. So just because the OT had a few flaws, that means we should overlook the MANY flaws of the PT? Do two wrongs make a right?

When you look at the PT and the OT at a microscopic level, you'll find several things that make absolutely no sense. The reason the OT movies are so much better is because the story is interesting to follow. They aren't better because they don't have Jar Jar Binks or other flaws like "chips that make slave's heads explode". The prequel movies are just boring, and thats why they are worse. And part of the reason they are so boring is that we already know what is going to happen.

That's just a totally unrelated and stupid point. It's like you're trying to start a fight.

I'm not trying to start a fight. I'm just stating the truth from an objective view.

It's just that when someone ends their post with an unrelated addition about how we're all mindless sheep just trying to please Chef Elf- it ticks me off.

And it ticks me off how nearly every person has to mention that George Lucas is an idiot or has committed the worst crime possible against humanity with the prequel creation. Like I said before, this is equivalent to being given life from God, something nobody deserved, and then getting all pissy at God because traffic is bad Monday morning.

This post has been edited by Storm: 17 May 2005 - 12:45 AM

[Jordan]

OH god PEOPLE. No movie is flawless! It goes with out saying. We here are not talking about minor nitpicks, we're talking about major fuck ups. The PT's don't have minor flaws, the entire film is just wrong.

Acting, plot, over use of graphics, drama, romance, etc... Everything is wrong. I learned nothing about Vader in episode 1. Then in episode 2 I learn, by an off screen reference about gundarks, that Anakin is now good friends with OB1 but hates him as well and is mad about life in general. I saw a clone war that put me to sleep and then a hand was cut off and yoda jumped around and the movie ended.

Two episodes have gone by and practically nothing relevant has been shown. Anakin had a good life to start of with, happy kid who loved his mom (*note, Lucas totally dropped the ball with portraying young annie as a slave who 'deserves a better life') then out of the blue he turns into a creepy teenager with much angst. His mom dies and he falls in love with some girl. Oh wait, he also wants to be 'the most powerful jedi ever' this is due to his moms passing and some how he thinks he can stop death, no really, he just thinks he can with no backing whatsoever.

This is what I'm going in with in to EP III. Everything else was just eye candy, and boring eye candy at that.

I'm not convinced he loves padme, I'm not convinced he had a rough childhood, I'm not convinced he's friends with OB1, I'm not convinced he's mad about everything.

Civillian Number 2 once said something along the lines of "distrot teenagers like Anakin don't grow up to become psychopathic killers like Vader'

And it's so true. I've had friends who've lost girlfriends and mothers etc.. They did not go buck wild, but dealt with it and moved on. Weirdo's like Anakin grow up introverted and anti-social, but don't go grow up to be space age hitlers.

Lucas failed to show his inherent dark side, failed to fuel this anger, and dropped the ball royally with Anakin's character bridging between Episodes.

I say EP III is doomed since Anakin's character is already destroyed and Lucas does not have enough time to fill in all the missing blanks.

So you see, this is not a nitpick, but a blatant slap to the face. I did not think long and hard about this. IT came to me as I watched the film.

[snaithbert]

Like I said before, this is equivalent to being given life from God, something nobody deserved, and then getting all pissy at God because traffic is bad Monday morning.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Um yes.

That example is just so damn insane I don't even know how to dispute it.

Why not leave all God references out of George Lucas discussions.

George Lucas isn't god, he's just a bad moviemaker.

And we have the right to complain.

You're sick of people calling George Lucas an idiot?

Well I'm sick of people saying how lucky we are to have any Star Wars movies, so basically we shouldn't complain about them.

I don't know if George is an idiot or not, I don't know the man.

I do know that he's not a good storyteller or filmmaker.

That I know for sure now.

Also I hate when people say that one of the reasons the PT stinks is because we already know what's going to happen, etc.

A talented writer could have come up with good stories regardless of the fact that we know the outcomes. A talented writer could have made the journey fun, even though we already know the destination. George just couldn't do it. He hasn't got the talent that the people he hired to create the OT had.

One thing you said that I agree with is that the PT movies are boring. But please don't assume that they would have been boring if ANYONE made them. That is so not the case. In the hands of a different man, the PT movies could have been every bit as exciting as the OT. But in the hands of George Lucas, we got boring, poorly made movies.

The blame for the PT goes entirely to George Lucas. To suggest franchise fatigue or anything else is just a sign of denial. George Lucas may have created Star Wars, but he could not carry Star Wars. It was too much for him and he just wasn't up to it. Too bad he couldn't recognize that fact- and pass the job along to someone who was.

[azerty]

1 Luke had a bond with his friends (he's been with them for years)? So even though Vader knew the rebel base was on Yavin he waited years to go back and get them? Or did it take years to get to Hoth and start setting up a base. Or were there many adventures and scrapes that we somehow missed between Yavin and Hoth? And Solo and Leia just stared at each other for years, befor the big break up in the ice tunnel. Bollocks! They were only pals for a few weeks. And yet Dad can't feel his own kid becuase he has no bond with him? No no, it is different I tell you!

2. Lukes X wing had a hyperdrive, even though according to Obi Wan a fighter that size couldn't get this deep into space on it's own? Sure he was talking about tie fighters, but it all amounts to the same thing. Now wait, that's not the same thing!

3. Solo heard Mynocks attach themselves to the Falcon, but a Star Destroyer (or is that an Imperial Cruiser) can't feel another ship attching itself to the back of the bridge? (I accept this one cause it was cool, actually)

4. To quote Imperial officer X - No ship that small has a cloaking device, (except Fett's ship, which is even smaller). Is this the same wanker who decided that the ship could be on the "other side of the galaxy" after 15 minutes? Yeah, well he didn't really mean it, and anyway, that's different!

7. Lukes X wing is built to withstand the brutality of space? Do you mean the absence of any kind of molecules whatsoever? I can imagine the desingers saying to themselves, "You know, one day a dumbass might fly this thing to an uncharted planet, and then decide to dive straight in (going full speed of course) with no visibility, all scopes dead, and then hit a few trees and end up in a swamp. We'd better structure up for that likely scenario!"

For more about the subject, got to

http://www.chefelf.c...?showtopic=2836

or for the same thing again try

http://www.chefelf.c...?showtopic=1894

[StarWarsIsUs]

Lucas used to be a good movie maker. Now he is just stupid. I think we can all accept this, gusher or basher. To some extent.

[snaithbert]

Lucas used to be a good movie maker. Now he is just stupid. I think we can all accept this, gusher or basher. To some extent.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Amen, brother.

[Dark_Sith]

I will not accept the fact that he is a bad moviemaker. I think he did a great job with the Prequel. Once again, I don't see what the big deal is with the freakin' Prequels. You guys over-analyze things way too much. I still love the Prequels and the Originals. I still think Lucas is a great director, and will always think that.

[HeckHouse]

Azerty, your points are so off base that I won't even bother to prove you wrong.

[azerty]

Yes, it's better not to overstrain yourself Heckhouse, probably your ability to use the force has been diminished....

Tomatometer down to 83 percent with just over 14 hours to go. I wonder if I should see it in Spanish or in French, since I am in the Pyrenees, and those are my 2 choices. Will it be improved by semi comphensibility of dialog, or should I just give up all hope and just stay home

[Jordan]

Darth Sith.

I gave you a very non-indepth break down of why AOTC and TPM sucked, about 5 or so posts above.

Lucas is not a great director. Even his actors say so. By trade he's an editor. He can't direct, he was naive to think he could take on the PT by himself.

[HeckHouse]

Did he edit the PT himself? If so, he can't do that well either.