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Is the catholic church a cult? Sensitive subject off the port bow!

#1 User is offline   Voodoo Dog Icon

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Posted 19 April 2005 - 05:03 PM

All this malarky about evil cults brainwashing people in the media got me thinking. It got me thinking that yes that IS true, evil cults ARE brainwashing people left, right and center. But don't all established religions do that? Haven't they been doing that for centuries? What, when you get right down to it IS the difference between a cult and a religion? Do religions just have better PR? Let's take a little look at the catholic church and see how it fares.

Hey, I just realised that with the pope dead, this post is even more offensive to catholics than it would have been before! That's handy!

Oh and by the by, just in case anyone accuses me of being a catholic-hating bigot, I would like to point out three things.

1. I'm irish. In fact i'm drunk as I type this (Don't worry, it's only racist if someone who isn't irish says that.)

2. I'm technically a catholic. That is a priest poured water over my head when I was a baby while no doubt stroking my small smooth buttocks. I have been to mass three times in my life (YES THREE WHOLE FUCKING TIMES!), so I feel I am qualified on the subject.

which leads to

3. Fuck you all, i'm going to say WHATEVER I LIKE.

Anyway...

The catholic church until very recently practised brainwashing. That is they told people they would be tortured eternally if they didn't do EXACTLY as the church told them to. My mother has VERY bitter memories of this, as she told me over a pint or two of whiskey. Every mass the priest would go on and on about what sins would land you in hell. It's interesting to note that he never went on about murder, genocide and the like. Hardly anyone gets the urge to do that. No according to him the #1 way to hades was thoughts of SEX. Yes give into your carnal urges and you risk the devil! This is the IDEAL way to brainwash naive teenagers. Think about it...

You are born with inbuilt drives that help sustain you. The drives for food, water and so on. These drives are EXTREMELY POWERFUL and very hard to resist.

The church cannot say the drive for food and drink is a sin because parishoners would keep dropping dead which would be annoying to say the least.

They can however say carnal desires are a sin because they are there to sustain the species as a whole not you. It is therefore the only biological drive a person is technically capable of resisting their entire lives.

EVERY SINGLE PERSON ON THE FUCKING PLANET HAS HAD A SEXUAL THOUGHT AT SOME POINT IN THEIR LIVES.

So if everyone thought it was a sin to have a sexual thought and concluded that they were going to BURN BABY BURN! They would have to come weeping to the priest begging for salvation. The priest could say "Gladly my child. As long as you make a FUCKING donation".

Gee what A COINCIDENCE. I DON'T THINK.

I WAS going to write more on this subject but this post is getting longer than an elephants dick so i'll stop here

see ya!
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#2 User is offline   Jane Sherwood Icon

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Posted 19 April 2005 - 08:25 PM

...

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#3 User is offline   SimeSublime Icon

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 01:19 AM

Perhaps you would like to take a look in the debate club section of the forums. Lets face it, there aren't that many religious types in these parts, so you're mostly preaching to the choir(excuse the pun, I couldn't think of a non-puntastic way of saying it).
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#4 User is offline   Random George Icon

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 05:24 AM

Is it any wonder I have such little faith in Christians. Sure, Jesus may have been an okay bloke… but it shouldn’t have been taken any further then that… soon they were justifying every they did by saying it was in the name of god. I find that this religion in particular has/can be very manipulative when it wants to be. Even now the Vatican is harboring secrets that would destroy the system if it leaked out…

And having the hide to go to other countries saying that Christianity is the true religion, and all others are bullocks! Saying they were “saving them” which usually meant taking over. The Nerve! And St Patrick’s Day!? The day people celebrate in recognition of St Patrick driving the snakes out of Ireland… snakes? Hmm... Don’t you mean… Pagans!? The original tenets of the emerald isles?

Those Christians gave Satan horns so they could point fingers at the pagans and say they worshipped the devil, while in fact the pagan god represented peace and balance (the horns representing re growth and nature)… and speaking of pagan gods, there was a male and female god, both equal in their own rights (non of this male dominant bullshit you get in the Christian faith)

So children… in conclusion: The streets will be steeped in the blood of Christians!! LONG LIVE NEO-PAGANISM!! BOOOWWHAADEEEE!!! Don’t chew the communion bread children! Don’t chew the bread!! Because apparently, if you do, you ROT-IN-HELL!!

In true Dutch courage style, George grabs a broom which he honestly thinks is a gun (due to his altered perception) and runs out the front door. But only after a few meters out, gets hit by a speeding car…
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#5 User is offline   Voodoo Dog Icon

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 07:01 AM

Thanks Jane! I wuv you too!

Anyway, yes I suppose I should have posted this in the debate forums but I wanted all readers of FR.COM to have a go at me so I posted what i thought was a very delicate topic. But you're probably right most people on the net are either atheists or fundamentalists and this don't look like a fundie site to me. I should have posted something along the lines of

"Blackadder is complete and utter CRAP!!"

(Which I don't think it is, I hasten to mention)

Besides if I post here there is a slim chance Yahtzee will reply! Yes we all know his feelings on this subject but I am sure he will rephrase them in a witty, original way!

Anyway, back on topic,

paedophiles in the church!

Now I don't know about the rest of the world, but whenever YET ANOTHER case of choir boy raping comes up, everyone in Ireland (or at least those over sixty) says something along the lines of "You can't judge the whole church by a few bad apples, you're just predjudiced against the catholic church." I have the following thing to say to these people.

BOLLOCKS!!!!!!

Not only is the church full of paedophiles. The management actually help cover it up! If a so-called cult like the Jehovah's witnesses or the scientologists acted like this where would they be? I'll tell where they would fucking be.

THEY WOULD BE SWINGING FROM THE NEAREST FUCKING LAMP-POST, THATS WHERE THEY WOULD FUCKING BE!!!

If anything people are being predudiced towards cults. Give them the right to molest kiddies! They're people too!!
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#6 User is offline   Yahtzee Icon

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 07:11 AM

Listen. Stop trying to be me. Try to be someone worthwhile, like Stephen Hawking.
As I walked through the valley of the shadow of death, I realised that it could do with a lick of paint.
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#7 User is offline   Voodoo Dog Icon

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 08:43 AM

Ummm...

Actually now that I look at my original post it DOES have a kind of "Yahtzee Update" quality to it. This was unintentional. I was, as I mentioned, incredibly drunk while writing it (If fact i'm still trying to get the vomit off the keyboard). I apologise heartily Yahtzee.
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#8 User is offline   Chyld Icon

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 09:49 AM

Meh, I wouldn't sweat it. I think the Y-man's getting a bit peeved with people jumping on his style. First Heccubus, then me, plus whoever else... I imagine the idea of yet another on the bandwagon might make him snap...
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#9 User is offline   floppydisk Icon

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Posted 20 April 2005 - 03:25 PM

For my thoughts on the catholic church, gohere.

Other than that, welcome to the forums, VD. I'm sure you'll make an excellent addition.
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#10 User is offline   Voodoo Dog Icon

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Posted 21 April 2005 - 07:34 AM

QUOTE (floppydisk @ Apr 20 2005, 09:25 PM)
Other than that, welcome to the forums, VD. I'm sure you'll make an excellent addition.


Now I feel all warm and squishy inside. Although thats probably the puppy I had for lunch. And thanks for pointing out to the world that the initials of my nickname are VD! Ha Ha story of my life. Well fuck it, i like my name and i'm not changing it now. Innuendo be damned!

I just looked at this thread in the cold light of day and I have to admit, it does look like my own personal blog. You guys must be used to new menbers doing irritating things by now, but this must still chafe the nipples somewhat. Sorry. I will now be posting my dark, dark thoughts on that "pope" thing you linked me to.

P.S.

When I started this thread, the sub-title "Sensitive subject off the port bow" struck me as clever, original and funny. I can now see it is none of these. I hereby apologise for my feeble attempt at humour.
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#11 User is offline   SimeSublime Icon

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Posted 21 April 2005 - 08:35 AM

And so the veil of ignorance is lifted. It's always more fun when you realise yourself. Welcome aboard.
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#12 User is offline   floppydisk Icon

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Posted 21 April 2005 - 03:38 PM

I don't mind lots of posts if they're funny. You're pretty gunny. And funny. I can't spell.
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#13 User is offline   Rhubarb Icon

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Posted 21 April 2005 - 07:42 PM

Frankly, I tend to get really annoyed at people who jump all over the Catholic church with such venom. Before you start bitching at me, bear in mind that I'm very anti-church and don't adhere to any religion, and would love to see the Church with a hell of a lot less influence over the lives of people who aren't actually Catholic. I think it's hideous that an organisation can manipulate so many people into behaving a certain way. Although I guess it says a lot more about basic humanity than about the Church leaders.

Altogether now, kiddies... what do we need? "SEPERATION OF CHURCH AND STATE." Well done, my little dears. You all get sweeties.

My gripe here is that yelling generalised bullshit like TEH CHURCH IS FULL OF PAEDOPHILES and THEY BRAINWASH PEOPLE kind of makes me want to reject everything you say out of hand. You give the rest of us anti-religious types a bad name, because then the fundies and fascists can look down their noses at us and shake their heads with pity. Cunts.

I can understand your view 'cos you're Irish, and would have had to put up with a Catholic schools and Catholic-imposed rules on a lot of everyday facets of life, and as you say, all manner of dogmatic psychosis on the part of priests. Plus Irish are sexy.

But the Church is not a cult. A cult is defined as "A religion or religious sect generally considered to be extremist or false, with its followers often living in an unconventional manner under the guidance of an authoritarian, charismatic leader".

1. Too many people adore the Church for it to be 'generally considered extremist'.

2. Same goes for 'its followers living in an unconventional manner'... it may be unnatural and weird, but it isn't unconventional when pretty much our entire culture is based off remnants and vestiges of Christian teachings in some way.

3. Darth Ratzinger is not charismatic.

Just a tip... if you're less generalised, and stick to proven, established facts, then you're a lot more credible, and religious types then can't just dismiss you as 'bigoted heathen' quite so easily. Not so much an issue on this forum, I'd guess, but speaking as someone who frequents other forums with a few right-wing Christians, it's much more satisfying when they're the ones who get so angry they start typo-ing with the incoherency of their rage, and peppering you with abuse and capital letters.
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#14 User is offline   Voodoo Dog Icon

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Posted 21 April 2005 - 08:58 PM

Hey, maybe this thread isn't as dead as I thought.


QUOTE (Rhubarb @ Apr 22 2005, 01:42 AM)
But the Church is not a cult. A cult is defined as "A religion or religious sect generally considered to be extremist or false, with its followers often living in an unconventional manner under the guidance of an authoritarian, charismatic leader".


As much as I appreciated your general comment, this part threw me off. By that definition if the scientologists became wildly popular overnight, they would be considered a religion. I doubt this would happen, because in most peoples minds, cults are cults and religions are religions and never the twain should meet. Oh, and maybe pope ratz-thingee isn't charismatic but the man who started the church was. Specifically, Jesus Christ. I put it to you that this man fulfils all qualifications to be a cult leader.

And you have to admit, the church contains more paedophiles than sheer coincidence should allow.
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#15 User is offline   Voodoo Dog Icon

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Posted 21 April 2005 - 09:07 PM

(mere seconds after writing last post)

I just realised I quoted the wrong bit. It should have been this.

QUOTE (Rhubarb @ Apr 22 2005, 01:42 AM)
Too many people adore the Church for it to be 'generally considered extremist'.



Anyway, maybe I came on a little strong, but these cunts ruined my life. They were the second worst thing to happen to Ireland, after the British empire.

And yes, Irish ARE sexy. Thank you for noticing.
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