[J m HofMarN]

This book is to Tolkien fans what blueprints of the USS Enterprise are to Star Trek fans. I was reading it last night and I finally realized what the significance of Aragorn's ring is. The ring of Barahir which is worn by Aragorn in the book and in the movies actually goes back even further than the existence of the rings made by Sauron and the elves. That ring was given by Finrod Felagund lord of Nargothrond to a man named Barahir who saved his life and Barahir is the ancestor of Aragorn as well as the kings of Numenor. Theres such a rich tapestry behind the trilogy that its taking me a long time to unravel it all but I love it.

[Madam Corvax]

The problem of Simalrillion is that reading it resembles reading the phone book.
While it is actually nice to know the background story for LOTR, the work as a whole just suffers from the lack of uniform tone of narration. It is simply too much squeezend into one volume.

Some bits of it are superb - Beren and Luthien tale, tale of Turbin Turambar, the story of Feanor.

But it is simply too much. It just leaves me dumb from marvelling at the sheer size of the creation, that's all. Nobody has the time it takes to read it these days.

[Chefelf]

The problem of Simalrillion is that reading it resembles reading the phone book.
While it is actually nice to know the background story for LOTR, the work as a whole just suffers from the lack of uniform tone of narration. It is simply too much squeezend into one volume.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That's the problem I had with it when I tried to read it when I was in Junior High School. Maybe I'd find it more interesting now, I don't know. I was one of the few people in my group of friends (and still am, I suppose) who just didn't like the Lord of the Rings books at all. I don't know what it is. I just never liked them. Read them all, was bored or annoyed with them. Saw the movies, more of the same.

Not quite sure how I made it to read The Silmarillion if I felt that way, but there you have it. I think it was just because the book was around.

Having said all of that, I can understand how a fan of those books would love reading it. I would gladly read a similar book about The Karate Kid.

[J m HofMarN]

"And thusly did Tiagi, the great great grandsire of Mr. Miagi, slay the Gorgoroth of Mianmar. But, ere the battle had ended, he was given a mortal wound, and thus said to his son, Riago: 'Riago. Fly from here. You must journey to the land of Seattle. There shalt thou find the wisdom of my elf-friend Soljar, who shall bring you into his house, for you are of the line of Elrir, son of Fenrir and there is friendship between our houses.' And thusly he died after giving his ring to his only son in token of his lineage."

Actually I find that the Silmarillion would be a great deal easier to follow if I had about ten family trees and two maps of middle earth(one before the breaking of the world and one after) available to me at all times. I wonder, have any of you considered that maybe Tolkien just did the Silmarillion for himself, and perhaps never meant to publish it? It seems rather like just an author's notes on the history of their world and I believe that if Tolkien had really meant to send it out he would have done it in the form of various stories from the views of people such as Feanor, Fingon the High King, Maedhros, Beren, Turgon, Turin, and maybe even Manwe or Ulmo.

This post has been edited by J m HofMarN: 03 February 2005 - 06:06 PM

[Despondent]

Yes. And he went much further creating nine to twelve movies' worth of material, without dangling it in front of a hungry and dumbed-down audience than others.

[Emu]

I read this during the summer, and I liked it, especially once I had gotten through the first few chapters. I liked the format of numerous interconnected stories that added depth and history to the trilogy.

[Madam Corvax]

The Polish translation I bought in 1986 actually HAD a couple of maps and some family trees attached to it and I found it a great help.

And Tolkien never finished Silmarillion. It was his son Christopher who completed the book (it was published posthumously) and I think that accounts for the non-uniform style.

Also this "further material" Despondent mentioned it was also compiled by his son. Has anyone even attemptedd to read it? JM, you are familiar wiht Unifinished Tales, aren't you? How can you read a book where footnotes are more lenghty than the text iself? It was just too much for me. I got it on my shelf, but rather as a reference, not a great bedtime reading.

And JM - that was lovely bit of a parody and it just sums up the problem of the phonebookishness of Siimarillion.

[SimeSublime]

The problem of Simalrillion is that reading it resembles reading the phone book.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That is the best summation of the book I have ever heard. Well done.

That's the problem I had with it when I tried to read it when I was in Junior High School.  Maybe I'd find it more interesting now, I don't know.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I attempted to read it again last year, and it didn't get any easier then whey I tried in high school.

[J m HofMarN]

I think the trick to it is to just enjoy the story that's put forth and not try to figure out how everyones related and why the whole thing matters. If you can just read it for that then you can make the connections later. For instance, did you guys know that Arwen is actually Aragorn's cousin several times removed. Elrond is Aragorn's great great great great great grewat great great great uncle.

[barend]

ah yes descendant of Elros.
Elrond and Elros, were both half-elven... Elrond chose to live as an elf and served under Gil-galad, and established Rivendell.

Elsros chose to be human and established Numanor, serving as its first king.

arwen isn't aragorns cousin, she's his great, great, great, great, great, great, great... etc. grand aunt.

i think that's even more disturbing.

[J m HofMarN]

no no. Elrond and Elros are brothers. Elrond begat Arwen and Elros begat the kinds of Numenor. Therefore Arwen would be the cousin to all kings of Numenor and Elrond would be their uncle.

[barend]

no, i was saying (aragorn): descendant of elros...

i was saying elrond and elros are brothers.

and Elros begat Vardamir Nólimon, Tindómiel, Manwendil,and Atanalcar.
who were cousins with the children of Elrond; Elladan, Elrohir,and Arwen!!!

Aragorn was generations after.

Tar-Amandil (2nd king of Numenor, but third generation ie. grandson of Elros) was the son of Arwens cousin Vardamir, making him Arwens nephew. And HIS son Tar-Elendil (not to be confused with Elendil father of Isildur) would then of course be Arwens great-nephew.

[J m HofMarN]

Zounds, there was a lot of bad stuff going on in Tolkien's world.

[barend]

i think you've misunderstood...

i was just trying to explain that you can only be cousins with people of your generation. other wise your a nephew, great nephew or etc.

there were plenty of generations between aragorn and arwen to wash the grossnes of it out.

turin on the other hand... well that was a dirty set up.

[J m HofMarN]

Damn straight. Of all the death speeches I've ever heard Glaurungs has to be the worst. "Well you killed me, good job, but guess what asshole, you just knocked up your sister!"