[georgelucas4greedo]

You have all lost me! This is why SW fans get a bad name. Cant we just enjoy the legacy of SW without trying to apply the rules of earth to its universe!

[Zatoichi]

Ah, Kurgan X, that was absolutely positively hilarious. I enjoyed him poking fun at ESB and ROTJ the best.

[TheEmpireStrikesBack]

I don't understand the Empire bashing considering the science in Star Wars was NEVER logical and was never intended to be (like why is there sound in space?!!! Why does every planet have one atmosphere, etc) so singling out Empire is silly. ALL THE STAR WARS MOVIES have things that are illogical about them. Onto the criticisims.

1. First off, a couple of the criticisms were actually aimed at the DVD versions of the film, which were changed from the original version. The scene with Vader talking with the Emperor was one of the dumbest changes George made. In the original version of Empire, Vader knew EXACTLY who Luke was. Also, Boba Fett did not have an accent in the original version.

2. The characters being less developed. Are you kidding me? Princess Leia is amusing in Star Wars, but her character is pretty cold and one note. She was much more real in Empire. When Alderaan blows up, she looked consitpated, but when Han was frozen she looked devastated. Luke was a whiny farmboy and Han was a selfish pirate with a change of heart at the end. In Empire we see that Luke has the potential to turn to the dark side. And Han being less developed? No way. He was one note also in SW until the very end of the movie. In Empire, he risks his life to save Luke, etc.

3. Luke was not the leader of the Rebel Alliance. He was a commander in the Alliance, not THE leader. He was A leader. Heck, if you want to complain about him going off for his training and abandoning the Rebellion, then why not bash Mon Mothma and Admiral Ackbar who are the head of the Alliance, yet are nowhere to be found in Star Wars and Empire. Shame on them.

4. The cave on Daghobah is not evil. The dark side of the force is present. Sheesh, that's one of the most thought provoking scenes in the film. Luke's face inside Vader's mask? BRILLIANT!

5. THREE YEARS pass between Star Wars and Empire. If Luke had NOT been made a commander within three years of destroying the Death Star, then something would be very wrong.


This thread is entertaining. However, I think these so-called "faults" are real nitpicks and stretches. To look at a fantasy/space adventure and get annoyed that stuff is unrealistic doesn't make sense. It's not SUPPOSED to be taken that literally. You could look at Star Wars and Return of the Jedi and find as many similar faults. For example, if Leia KNEW they were being tracked in Star Wars, why the hell did she risk the lives of the ENTIRE Alliance by going directly to the Rebel Base? Also, why is it that Luke becomes so powerful in the force between Empire and Jedi when he doesn't get any training? Why are stormtroopers such terrible handling blasters? How do the Ewoks have so few casualties during the battle of endor? Why are so few Rebel soldiers shown during the battle of endor? Where the heck is the super star destroyer in the first Star Wars movie? Why would the Empire be dumb enough to build another death star with a self destruct? Heck, why do ALL death stars have a self destruct? And don't get me started on the prequels....

[TheEmpireStrikesBack]

Okay, here's why the original Star Wars is rubish!!! (note: I love this movie)

1. What the hell was the point of sending those tie fighters to attack the Falcon right after they got off the Death Star, when they were tracking them? What if one of those damn fighters had actually destroyed the Falcon? That would have been ridiculous.

2. If Leia knew the Falcon was being tracked, WTF was she doing going straight to the Rebel base and putting the entire Alliance at stake? Wouldn't it have made a LOT more sense if Leia had gone to some other planet and then taken a different ship back to the Rebel Base?

3. When Luke switches his computer off, the guy from the Rebel Base should have been a LOT more furious that Luke switched off his targeting computer. I mean, this is Luke's first ever space battle and the kid thinks he can hit that teeny eensy weensy targeting shaft WITHOUT the computer?!!!!

4. WTF didn't Chewie get a medal?

5. Why does Vader grab the rebel soldier by the throat when he can just force choke him?

6. Why the heck does Vader take orders from Grandma Tarkin, who he could kill in two seconds?

7. Why does Obiwan go by "Ben" Kenobi? It seems kindof pointless. If he thinks people won't recognize him cause he changes his first name, he's pretty dumb.

8. If the Death Star can destroy an entire planet but they can't blow up rebel ships, that's pretty stupid.

9. After the first trench run was a disaster, why didn't the alliance send in a second trio of fighters to trail the tie fighters once they got into the shaft? Why was Han Solo the only one who could figure that out?

10. Why didn't the Emperor come to the Death Star after dissolving the Senate?

11. Why is the entire rescuing Princess Leia sequence so damn similar to the Wizard of Oz? It's almost identical. THey take the bad guys' uniforms, break in and rescue the girl. Could it get any more similar?

12. Why is it that the film would have absolutely SUCKED if not for the amazing editing and musical score?

13. Why the heck would the same blast that closes the door also blast the controls that extend the bridge?

14. Why didn't they need to do CPR on Luke after he was under water so long?

15. Luke said they couldn't go after R2 at night because of all the sand people, yet he was attacked by them in broad daylight! DOes that mean Sandpeople never sleep? Now THAT's absurd!!!

16. Why the heck was Luke even allowed to fight in the Battle of Yavin the minute after he arrived? He didn't even have to go through basic training! What type of miliartary unit would allow some newcomer to just join in the battle?

17. Why does Luke whine about wanting to leave Tatooine, yet when Obiwan offers him a free ticket off the planet, he whines that he has to stay home!!

18. Why does Princess Leia sometimes have a British accent?

19. Why can the Death Star get to Yavin so quickly, yet the rebel base takes forever to be in range?

20. Isn't it way too convenient that the first R2 unit selected by Owen has a bad motivator?

21. Why can Luke take the restraining bolt off R2, but he can't put it back on?

22. Why the heck can Han understand Chewie when all he says is rarrrrahhh?!!!!

23. Why is Luke so close with Obiwan, when he spends like one day with him?!!!

24. Why doesn't Leia look that upset when her home planet is destroyed? She doesn't even cry or scream as the planet blows up!

25. Why is C3P0 such a worry wart when he's a robot?

Seriously, Star Wars is no more logical than Empire. They're not supposed to be taken so seriously.

[Despondent]

Oi Moi. Youssa so wise. deh old moviess suck as bad as the knew ones Meessa seessa now. I pwopose EE-mergency powders.

[TheEmpireStrikesBack]

I don't think it matters that Empire didn't get 100% glowing reviews (NO film has ever gotten all good reviews btw) when it came out. "Vertigo" was a critical bomb upon its release yet became a "masterpiece" over time. Empire is now routinely chosen as the best Star Wars film and over time it just gets better and better.

And keep this in mind, because this is not opinion, but fact. Before Empire, no blockbuster film had ever had a blockbuster sequel. Never, ever. At that point in time sequels were almost always remakes of the original which bombed at the box office. The Empire Strikes Back's success guaranteed that all remaining SW films would be automatic blockbusters. Even the Godfather 2, which won best picture wasn't even one of the FIVE highest grossing films of the year it came out (the first Godfather was the top grossing film of 1972).

I would also bet that had Empire bombed, it would have been the last SW film made and the ORIGINAL Star Wars would not be as fondly remembered as it is today. Look at how the Star Wars special edition creamed the ET special edition.

[georgelucas4greedo]

Time for some serious gushing!!

Okay, here's why the original Star Wars is rubish!!! (note: I love this movie)

1. What the hell was the point of sending those tie fighters to attack the Falcon right after they got off the Death Star, when they were tracking them? What if one of those damn fighters had actually destroyed the Falcon? That would have been ridiculous.

1. Plan A was to destroy the plans that R2 had, so if they destroyed the Falcon as Bush would say "Mission Accomplished" Plan B follow them

2. If Leia knew the Falcon was being tracked, WTF was she doing going straight to the Rebel base and putting the entire Alliance at stake? Wouldn't it have made a LOT more sense if Leia had gone to some other planet and then taken a different ship back to the Rebel Base?

2. They needed the DS to follow them if they were to destroy it. It was their only hope remember

3. When Luke switches his computer off, the guy from the Rebel Base should have been a LOT more furious that Luke switched off his targeting computer. I mean, this is Luke's first ever space battle and the kid thinks he can hit that teeny eensy weensy targeting shaft WITHOUT the computer?!!!!

3. Whatever

4. WTF didn't Chewie get a medal?

4. Again whatever.

5. Why does Vader grab the rebel soldier by the throat when he can just force choke him?

5. Dramatic significance.

6. Why the heck does Vader take orders from Grandma Tarkin, who he could kill in two seconds?

6. You answered your own question, Vader is a hot head, Tarkin is there to keep him in check. Look what happens without the Moff in ESB, Vader kills everything in sight.

7. Why does Obiwan go by "Ben" Kenobi? It seems kindof pointless. If he thinks people won't recognize him cause he changes his first name, he's pretty dumb.

7. Ok thats legitimate. But come on.

8. If the Death Star can destroy an entire planet but they can't blow up rebel ships, that's pretty stupid.

8. It can it has gun towers jackass

9. After the first trench run was a disaster, why didn't the alliance send in a second trio of fighters to trail the tie fighters once they got into the shaft? Why was Han Solo the only one who could figure that out?

9. Rebels are terrible at strategy. Thats why the couldnt win shit without Luke.

10. Why didn't the Emperor come to the Death Star after dissolving the Senate?

OO so he can die in the first movie?

11. Why is the entire rescuing Princess Leia sequence so damn similar to the Wizard of Oz? It's almost identical. THey take the bad guys' uniforms, break in and rescue the girl. Could it get any more similar?

11. Thats not really a gap in logic.

12. Why is it that the film would have absolutely SUCKED if not for the amazing editing and musical score?

Tell us!

13. Why the heck would the same blast that closes the door also blast the controls that extend the bridge?

It was built by clones, theres bound to be some bad genes.

14. Why didn't they need to do CPR on Luke after he was under water so long?

He had a JUB or whatever that thing was from TPM

15. Luke said they couldn't go after R2 at night because of all the sand people, yet he was attacked by them in broad daylight! DOes that mean Sandpeople never sleep? Now THAT's absurd!!!

15. He encroached their territory. At night they hunt and are less restrained by locality.

16. Why the heck was Luke even allowed to fight in the Battle of Yavin the minute after he arrived? He didn't even have to go through basic training! What type of miliartary unit would allow some newcomer to just join in the battle?

16. Umm they needed all the help they could get.

17. Why does Luke whine about wanting to leave Tatooine, yet when Obiwan offers him a free ticket off the planet, he whines that he has to stay home!!

17. Why do you get homesick when you go to college?
18. Why does Princess Leia sometimes have a British accent?

19. Why can the Death Star get to Yavin so quickly, yet the rebel base takes forever to be in range?

19. See answer 5.

20. Isn't it way too convenient that the first R2 unit selected by Owen has a bad motivator?

20. Yes.

21. Why can Luke take the restraining bolt off R2, but he can't put it back on?

Hes not a mechanic.

22. Why the heck can Han understand Chewie when all he says is rarrrrahhh?!!!!

Dont be homocentric.

23. Why is Luke so close with Obiwan, when he spends like one day with him?!!!

23. Two words: Jedi master, who saved his life not once but twice.

24. Why doesn't Leia look that upset when her home planet is destroyed? She doesn't even cry or scream as the planet blows up!

24. Shock.

25. Why is C3P0 such a worry wart when he's a robot?

25. Hes gay.

[azerty]

Nice responses Mr. Empire! Civ2 too, of course.

There is a lot there to discuss. First of all, it isn't the nitpicks that lower the standard of the movie for me. Those are just nitpicks. A lot of people are nitpicking my nitpicks, (okay), but then using some kind of Extended Universe crap to somehow justify their counter arguments. The Star Wars movies are only movies. They should stand alone as kick ass pieces of art. Star Wars, (I can't call it "A New Hope") does stand alone, and it does kick ass; the rest of the films do not - Empire included. My post on page 5 of this thread goes into the pointlessness of technical arguments in a science fiction movie - just make up stupid pseudo technological reasons to explain all the stupid shit afterwards, and delcrare it as fact. That kind of stuff is irrelevant to my point.

I am impressed with your arguments, Mr. Empire, except for #5. Who says 3 years between the original and Empire Strikes Back? Some EU wanker, that's who. I heard this argument from Michael Orla in the "Star Wars forum: Time Dilation (Episodes 3 and 4)" ages ago. This was my argument then:

"That makes no sense! For three years between Star Wars and Empire the rebels did nothing, Solo and Leia just stared at each other, and Luke didn't learn anything about being a Jedi?"

So even though Vader knew the rebel base was on Yavin he waited 3 years to go back and get them? Or did it take 3 years to get to Hoth and start setting up a base? Or were there many adventures and scrapes that we somehow missed between Yavin and Hoth? And Solo and Leia just stared at each other for 3 years, before the big break up in the ice tunnel? Bollocks!

Naturally I received no response to my devastating counterpoint... I leave that to you.

Actually, I don't like your argument #3 much either. Who the Hell is Mon Mothma? That character is never even seen until Jedi, and NEVER mentioned by name. I assume it's that woman who give a bit of a speech before they go down to Endor. Besides the fact that she is utterly lame, (give me Sigourney Weaver's Ripley, or Tom Berenger from "Platoon", or somebody with a forceful presence as a battle leader) and the fact that it was just some EU wanker who decided that she was the "real" rebel leader, the core complaint is this: She only exists in another, separate movie which didn't appear until 3 years AFTER Empire! More Bollocks!

My argument can be boiled down to this: Why say "Led by Luke Skywalker" in your scroll up if that is not what you mean?

* * * * *

Here is another self plagerization from "Episode 3 forum: ROTS Final Countdown", to sum it all up as far as I am concerned:

Compared with Star Wars, (which has no flaws), Empire is a disappointment, in three distinct groups of ways.

1.) Logic flaws
The probe droids. It would take a thousand years for a thousand probe droids to find Bin Laden on Earth, so why are we asked to believe a galaxy can be searched this way and succeed? (Just have Darth use the force or something.) Despite what Civ says, it's weak.

The part where Luke can't pick up any life on Hoth when a huge beast is standing an arm's length away from him? (replace "I don't pick up any life.." with "This device is useless!" as he hurls it away in disgust, would have been enough for me.)

Why does Luke not stay in the cave until morning, like any cub scout should know? (He is from a desert planet, too, he should know about survival techniques).

Where should admiral Ozzel have come out of hyperspace, if not close to the system? Any further away wouldn't make any sense. (Drop out of lightspeed right next to the planet and start dropping bombs! What the fuck? It's a goddam AMBUSH for Christ sake! The indians don't jump out of the bushes 2 miles away, they jump out straight onto the covered wagon and start slitting throats.)

Why are harpoons and tow cables (which the speeders just "happen to have on board") the ONLY way of stopping the walkers. Especially when the rebels have an ion cannon, and Luke destroys a walker another way later anyway? (Have Luke request the cannon, and have the request denied, "Do your best, we need to clear a path for the ships...")

Why do 2 Star destroyers crash into each other while chasing the Falcon? (Okay it was cool, but have the helmsmen notice and try to avoid each other and still have the crash. "Sir, Captain X is ALSO diverting to starboard...")

After Threepio tells Solo EXACTLY what is wrong with the Hyperdrive engine, (the "Motivator"), why does Solo not just fix the problem instead of endangering everybody's lives by his incompetence with engines? He should know what's up - he made a few "special modifications himself"! Instead he mentions 3 alternative, and incorrect possibilities, (Unless Hydro-spanners are tools and not parts). Is not Threepio in direct communication with the Falcon?

How about Luke stealing a valuable spaceship disappearing for an unspecified length of time for his own personal business without telling ANYONE what he intends to do? Then, he charges in at full speed through zero visibility with "all the scopes dead" towards an unknown planet, and crashes in a lake. X-Wings can hover, can't they? (They could on Yavin anyway). Luke is a pilot, (and possibly a leader) and he should know better. At least he should be disciplined when he finally DOES show up at the rendezvous.

The Falcon lands on an asteroid in the stomach of a giant worm, OK. But that is no kind of believable digestive system. Mynocks even live in there permanently! A creature that big would not find enough food to live on a barren rock. How can Chewie and Solo walk around in space, in a worm's stomach without space suits?

Why does Chewie have all those tools and a broken droid with him in the prison cell? What kind of torture session is that supposed to be? (Torture Solo, and have Vader say "No point in torturing the Wookie, his mind is too small to have any effect...")

Why does Vader want to use carbonite to transport Luke to the emperor? If Lando didn't point out to him that it probably won't work, he might have accidentally killed Luke right in that pit, and then he would have been in trouble. (Ok, we need a frozen Solo, but Darth still ends up looking like a dumbshit.)

Why, at the end of the film when the heroes are all escaping in the Falcon, being chased by tie fighters and star destroyers, does Artoo make an offhand comment that he KNOWS that the Hyperdrive motor has been deactivated (the city computer told him so), but doesn't think it important to fix this BIG problem, but instead concentrates on welding Threepio's foot?

2.) Characters flaws
I guess some people found the characters dynamic; for whatever reason, I did not. Find an instance other than Darth is Dad, (which I always found ridiculous) where any character evolves in a way that wasn't totally predictable. Leia, Luke, Chewie, Artoo, Threepio, none of them ever made you sit up in surprise. And Lando's change of heart? Predictable. Yoda's personality? Just like every Hong Kong drunken master movie ever made.

3.) The lame script flaws:
From the scroll up it is ridiculous. Darth now knows Luke is his son, and is obsessed with finding him. I wonder how he suddenly worked that out, after 20 (plus your 3) years?

Solo says not enough life on Hoth to fill a "space cruiser". If this had been a pirate movie do you think they would have said fill a "Spanish Galleon"?

The "It's so good to see you fully functional", "Just as soon kiss a wookie", "pull the ears off a gundark", "nice try Laser Brains" quotes, etc. That is piss poor science fiction dialog.

How about battle dialog? "Watch that crossfire boys", (There is no crossfire, all the walkers are in front of you). "Set for position three!", (What, have you practiced attacking walkers and have a play book for just this situation?) How about when Luke's co-pilot states "We've got a malfunction in fire control!" Luke just ignores him and repeats his order "Hang on Dack, just hang on! Get ready to fire that tow cable!" (I was under the impression that it was malfunctioning.)

Now, the first attack on the death star had pretty interesting and realistic dialog, which seemed to contribute to the action. On the other hand, the dialog on the walker attack not only didn't contribute, it did not make any sense. It was Star Trek technical gibberish. Talk for the sake of noise.

What about general lines of story? Threepio TWICE calculates the odds of some random event, without any relevant data. Some doctor robot babbles on about T-47´s, presumably only to add more "science fiction type ambiance", but it is irrelevant to anything real, or anything we have ever heard of. And on and on and on.

Leigh Brackett is credited with doing such an awesome job, but it was crap! I could have done a better job. How? Keep all the plot bits that George wanted, but make an effort to connect these important bits in a believable way.

If the rebels needed to be found on Hoth, then use a sensible way to find them. Have Luke crash on Dagobah in a believable way, not in the utterly lame way that he did. If the rebels were looking for Luke in the snow, they should at least appear to make an effort! Don't have Artoo standing inside the hanger with a fly swatter sized antenna pretending to look for Luke. Appear as if you are really trying (Have the big parabolic dish frozen solid pointing at the sky, incapable of working until dawn, but have guys attempting to burn the ice off it with lasers) and fail anyway. Kill Ozzel for coming out of light speed too FAR from the system, not too close to it! If you are going to torture Chewie, do it, but don't let him set up a damn droid workshop WITH TOOLS in his prison cell. Don't pretend that the door slamming shut in front of Artoo in the corridor of Bespin was going to stop him following Luke, when it was obvious that the door sill was going to block him anyway.

Don't have Luke get into the Carbonite chamber elevator, (which was also the freezer) and not have Vader freeze him. If you argue that Vader wanted to talk to him first, then why does he try and freeze him so early on and say "All too easy"? Even having Luke mutter "Leia, hear me", when he is hanging off the bottom of Bespin is simply hitting us over the head with the fact that *Luke is using the Force now*! He should have been semi conscious and silent, and Leia should have felt him anyway. She should have just ordered Chewie to turn the ship around, and Chewie should have trusted her and done it. If you wanted to be really subtle, you could show Leia's scene before you show Luke hanging off the antenna. Even the audience would be thinking "What the Hell is she talking about?" just like Lando and Chewie were. Don't have Lando call the Falcon "the fastest hunk of junk in the galaxy" when we know full well that Solo made the "special modifications himself."

Any movie can have a few flaws and still be great stuff. Empire seems to be non-stop flaws in all departments. Sure, asteroids are cool, walkers are cool, etc. So is goddam Mustafar and whatever else blows up in the prequel. So what?

Some people think the rot set in with Phantom Menace. It set in long, long before.

[TheEmpireStrikesBack]

Time for some serious gushing!!
1. Plan A was to destroy the plans that R2 had, so if they destroyed the Falcon as Bush would say "Mission Accomplished" Plan B follow them

2. If Leia knew the Falcon was being tracked, WTF was she doing going straight to the Rebel base and putting the entire Alliance at stake? Wouldn't it have made a LOT more sense if Leia had gone to some other planet and then taken a different ship back to the Rebel Base?

2. They needed the DS to follow them if they were to destroy it. It was their only hope remember

3. When Luke switches his computer off, the guy from the Rebel Base should have been a LOT more furious that Luke switched off his targeting computer. I mean, this is Luke's first ever space battle and the kid thinks he can hit that teeny eensy weensy targeting shaft WITHOUT the computer?!!!!

3. Whatever

4. WTF didn't Chewie get a medal?

4. Again whatever.

5. Why does Vader grab the rebel soldier by the throat when he can just force choke him?

5. Dramatic significance.

6. Why the heck does Vader take orders from Grandma Tarkin, who he could kill in two seconds?

6. You answered your own question, Vader is a hot head, Tarkin is there to keep him in check. Look what happens without the Moff in ESB, Vader kills everything in sight.

7. Why does Obiwan go by "Ben" Kenobi? It seems kindof pointless. If he thinks people won't recognize him cause he changes his first name, he's pretty dumb.

7. Ok thats legitimate. But come on.

8. If the Death Star can destroy an entire planet but they can't blow up rebel ships, that's pretty stupid.

8. It can it has gun towers jackass

9. After the first trench run was a disaster, why didn't the alliance send in a second trio of fighters to trail the tie fighters once they got into the shaft? Why was Han Solo the only one who could figure that out?

9. Rebels are terrible at strategy. Thats why the couldnt win shit without Luke.

10. Why didn't the Emperor come to the Death Star after dissolving the Senate?

OO so he can die in the first movie?

11. Why is the entire rescuing Princess Leia sequence so damn similar to the Wizard of Oz? It's almost identical. THey take the bad guys' uniforms, break in and rescue the girl. Could it get any more similar?

11. Thats not really a gap in logic.

12. Why is it that the film would have absolutely SUCKED if not for the amazing editing and musical score?

Tell us!

13. Why the heck would the same blast that closes the door also blast the controls that extend the bridge?

It was built by clones, theres bound to be some bad genes.

14. Why didn't they need to do CPR on Luke after he was under water so long?

He had a JUB or whatever that thing was from TPM

15. Luke said they couldn't go after R2 at night because of all the sand people, yet he was attacked by them in broad daylight! DOes that mean Sandpeople never sleep? Now THAT's absurd!!!

15. He encroached their territory. At night they hunt and are less restrained by locality.

16. Why the heck was Luke even allowed to fight in the Battle of Yavin the minute after he arrived? He didn't even have to go through basic training! What type of miliartary unit would allow some newcomer to just join in the battle?

16. Umm they needed all the help they could get.

17. Why does Luke whine about wanting to leave Tatooine, yet when Obiwan offers him a free ticket off the planet, he whines that he has to stay home!!

17. Why do you get homesick when you go to college?
18. Why does Princess Leia sometimes have a British accent?

19. Why can the Death Star get to Yavin so quickly, yet the rebel base takes forever to be in range?

19. See answer 5.

20. Isn't it way too convenient that the first R2 unit selected by Owen has a bad motivator?

20. Yes.

21. Why can Luke take the restraining bolt off R2, but he can't put it back on?

Hes not a mechanic.

22. Why the heck can Han understand Chewie when all he says is rarrrrahhh?!!!!

Dont be homocentric.

23. Why is Luke so close with Obiwan, when he spends like one day with him?!!!

23. Two words: Jedi master, who saved his life not once but twice.

24. Why doesn't Leia look that upset when her home planet is destroyed? She doesn't even cry or scream as the planet blows up!

24. Shock.

25. Why is C3P0 such a worry wart when he's a robot?

25. Hes gay.

Hey, relax. I love that movie and was only kidding around. The whole point I'm trying to make is that Star Wars has its less than logical moments too.

[georgelucas4greedo]

Hey, relax. I love that movie and was only kidding around. The whole point I'm trying to make is that Star Wars has its less than logical moments too.

Dont tell me to relax...I had fun doing that

[diligent_d]

How about battle dialog? "Watch that crossfire boys", (There is no crossfire, all the walkers are in front of you). "Set for position three!", (What, have you practiced attacking walkers and have a play book for just this situation?)

No crossfire??? They were flying right in the middle of a massive field fire between both the AT-AT's and their own ground forces! That would constitute cross-fire. Not to mention there were probably a couple faster Scout Walkers firing at them from their flanks.

As for the "Set for position three!" as if they WOULDN'T have a tactical template when attacking AT-AT's? They've probably fought them more than a few times on other planets - it would be pretty ridiculous if they didn't.

[azerty]

If their plan involved getting caught between their own fire and the enemy's fire, then they need a new general.

If the rebels had fought walkers before on other planets more than a few times, then they should have taken a few notes. How about
"Note to self - armor too strong for blasters, wrap cables around the walker's legs and trip them up..."

P.S. "Assume imperials will be tricked by this unorthodox tactic yet again."

[civilian_number_two]

16. Why the heck was Luke even allowed to fight in the Battle of Yavin the minute after he arrived? He didn't even have to go through basic training! What type of miliartary unit would allow some newcomer to just join in the battle?

Before Lucas made up that jazz about Vader being Luke's father, there had been this idea that Luke's father had been a famous pilot. So they figured he'd be good, and he told them he was, so they went with it. They had a spare ship (don't know why, with all those guys around); Luke was eager; it's pretty classic adventure fiction; so we're supposed to forget that they just gave this stranger an expensive fighter plane and threw him in where he might jeapordize allies.

Remember: not science fiction; fantasy in space.

[TheEmpireStrikesBack]

I figured out a logical reason why Luke went on his own little journey after the battle of Hoth. He was a mililary leader in the rebel alliance, but not a political leader. Like all soldiers, Luke was on his tour of duty on Hoth. Once that mission was over, he had some time off to go about his personal life. Luke going to Daghobah after the battle of Hoth is more realistic than Luke showing up on Yavin and being allowed to fight 2 minutes later without any basic training. Hehe.

[Jordan]

That review of the film critic was f'in funny! Pretenious 101 ROFL

I was a bit shocked to find out that ESB did get bad reviews. It was a pretty tight movie. I never knew what it was like to experience SW as a new epic. I always had a vague idea of the backstory while watching them. Maybe if I watched it back in the day I would have hated it too. I had a boba fett toy before I saw ESB, that may have tainted my decision making. But if movies suck, I hate them with in 10 mintues. Save Batman begins and a few others. Most of the time I'm quick to make a review. I hated Episode 3 within record breaking time. I was annoyed right away with that stupid space battle. In TPM, I was enthralled for like the first 8 minutes. In AOTC, wait, I don't even remember how that started. Must have sucked then.

Many people thought the ending of ESB was too harsh and dark. But films around that time were all about that kind of shit. Have you ever seen french connection? What the fuck was that? It was in the 70's I think, but that's pretty close to when ESB was made.

This post has been edited by Jordan: 02 December 2005 - 10:20 PM