[J m HofMarN]

Hannibal- That's a fine thing for you to say, didn't the Nazis of your beloved conspiracy theories call the Jews savages?

[Slade]

Then they took the Jedi, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jedi. Then they came for me, and by that time there was no one left to speak for me.

Thanks, Nate, for that. I can't find where it was this time, but I liked it.

Hannibal: Let's look at the presentation here: UTF brings insults into debates, man is legitimately ridiculed for his lack of maturity. We dismissed him because he started name-calling

Therefore, when you launch a personal attack against JM, I get to call you a tosspot.

Tosspot.

Oh, and could I accuse you of being mad, and have you reply "I'm not mad, I'm just angry!" and I can respond "Yeah, you're mad." and you reply "No, I'm just angry!"? Huh, huh? Can we?

[J m HofMarN]

I think he went a little further than to fling an insult. Calling Palestinians terrorists, we all agree, has some basis in reality. Calling the Israeli's baby-killers does as well. They can be debated and the reasons for the arguments put forth, these are (while not necessarily correct) still terms that can be argued to further the debate.

Calling people savages is nonsense. It represents not just a slander on one's enemy but a marked egotism and superiority. For instance, the Indians were savages so it was necessary for whites to take their land so it could be put to non-savage uses. The Africans were savages so it was peachy for people to drag them about in cages and whip them.

To call someone a savage is to deny their humanity and place oneself and one's race over them. It's denying their entire culture and ideal system. VWing and Jordan have called the Palestinians plenty of names and I've called the Israelis plenty of names as well but being fairly together people I don't think any of us (save the culprit) would deny the humanity of the other side. We've seen what that leads to.

I'm curious though, UTF, just who else do you consider "savage"

[Hannibal]

The truth is that the message was intended for all, but since you ALL type your little insults to somehow manage your persuasions what else can anybody do? Hoffmarn and all his buddies will sling whatever shit they feel they can get away with no matter what the issue at hand, so long as they can discredit any and all opinions they don't like, and if anybody has an opinion which is truly and genuinely incorrect and negative, watching Hoffie and his few little buddies sling more shit makes no difference. Its too bad Hoffie that you like to declare permanant and absolutely your enemies, anyone who says anything you don't like, instead of engaging in real discussion. You might be able to persuade people that differ from your views if you weren't such an asshole to them, no matter what the issue is.

If for example somebody suggested something you disapprove of, say, "Yassir Arafat was a homosexual bottle cap collector." And for instance you know this is completeley untrue, you should provide facts and persuade the person who is so misinformed by logic and fact. No matter what the issue is, however, rediculous to you or conveniently rediculous to you...(What if the argument was Arafat accepted bribes and profited from deaths of his own people) it wouldn't matter to you, because anybody with an opinion, no matter how wrong it would appear, you don't bother to make your arguments clear, you dictatorially hand out your declarartions and condemn and reject people for the slightest to the most serious things.

If I was a communist, or socialist, I would hate to have you on my side, because your mode of conduct, and means of debate and discussion is rediculously one-sided and infantile. You know what you are doing, and this is perhaps worse.

If somebody came in here, was a racist, but wasn't overt, wasn't exactly using tons of slurs, wasn't exactly aware of it, would you attempt to reason with the person? Fuck no. You'd slap condemnatory labels other than "racist" on the person which are simply deragatory and have nothing to do with your arguments. This just makes things worse: it creates a passionate racist from an unwitting one.

But why bother explaining this shit to you, you live in constant denial of all your actions, and aparently feel no responsibility whatsoever for them.

This is called rationalization.

But hell, when you're Jm Hoffmarn, fuck everybody. fuck em if they differ in opinion, fuck em if they won't listen to yours, fuck em if you can't understand em and fuck em for even posting an opinion. fuck em all hoffie.

Gang politics work. Childish intimidation tends to drive the crowd.

Hoffie, you simply have a hostile attitude.

Is hostility toward some person posting in this forum absolutely necessary, no matter what their beliefs?

Its not like they're going to bomb your house. Here you have opportunity to persuade them to your side, with whatever rational sense you can muster.

Instead, you've turned the forums into Jm hoffmarn's opinion rules, fall into disfavor with Hoffie, and prepare to be mocked and intimidated by his mindless internet buddies. All five of them.

Personally I've seen you mock and disrespect religous beliefs not your own, political beliefs not your own, and practically anything not your own because you feel like it.

There's no stopping hoffie now, watch out, his personal internet revolution may make you a casualty of misunderstanding. Hoffie doesn't misunderstand, he fuckin knows all, and doesn't ask questions. Hoffie is incapable of such madness, to think it possible!

When hoffie says something, its %100 true, you can bet on it, question NOT!
When hoffie reads a post, if it doesn't meet his approval, fuckall, baby look out, endless and permanant abuse.

I write because I care Hoffmarn, start eatin what you dish out buddy, taste the spoiled wrath you so recklessley froth.

[J m HofMarN]

Hannibal old buddy, do you recall the discussion we had about how every topic on this forum is not simply meant for you to provide me with hillarious signatures?

[Slade]

I could go into how absurdly hypocritical your own post is, Hannibal, but the more you keep posting the exact same "arguements", the more I'll just have to repeat the exact same defense. So I won't, because I grew tired of it a week ago.

I'll just say that it is a shame that you squander what could very well be intelligence hidden within the murkiness of your doublespeak.

Lighten up a bit, you massage parlor. Or step outside with JM and settle this with a duel/fisticuffs...