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Why legalize assault weapons?

#31 User is offline   SimeSublime Icon

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Posted 19 October 2004 - 02:51 AM

I should possibly point out with my education and police comment, I didn't mean that Amber should do it all herself. I was saying that the government should invest in it, rather then just let people carry guns and leave their defence up to themselves. I realise it's not an imediate solution, but from my experience it seems a much better one. To put it another way, what would you prefer. Knowing that you have the ability to defend yourself, or knowing that you will never need to?
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#32 User is offline   Creaux Icon

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Posted 19 October 2004 - 02:58 AM

Well...I severely doubt that there would be any states that would allow you to bring a gun into a school building, particularly after the school shootings...But something that many non-Americans don't nessicarily understand is that America isn't really all that homogenous. People in my home state feel more akin to Brits than to people from Arkansas.

And yes, the Native Americans did have weaponry. So did the pioneers. It's regrettable, what my ancestors did, but there was plenty of killing on either side.

Amber-Nichole, I would suggest you get (I believe Windlass makes one, but I might be wrong) a 5.5 foot lowlander claymore, and hang it in your livingroom, easily visible from outside. Mount it on the wall so it can't be removed easily. It WILL stop any random thug who sees it. And it's fun. And they kill pumpkins VERY well. A .38 between mattresses or in some contraption in the headboard of the bed work well as a backup, too, I'll admit. A good, trained dog, though, is probably the best single home defence item I can think of, however. A gun doesn't help at all if they can stealth their way into your bedroom and catch you sleeping.

OK, so we have -scary medieval weapon, -pistol, and -dog. Now all we need is a 9-foot cement wall with razorwire and guardtowers with spots >;D

Sime, I agree with you in the ideal; however, if AN is 20 minutes from police help, then...that really might well not be good enough, y'know?

Actually, Amber, if there are any sane neighbors about, you might even consider some sort of mutual defence alliance >;D

This post has been edited by Creaux: 19 October 2004 - 02:59 AM

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#33 User is offline   SimeSublime Icon

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Posted 19 October 2004 - 03:12 AM

Perhaps it isn't quite so feasible, but I find it hard to comprehend that people would actually do that. Perhaps I'm naive, or just lucky.
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#34 User is offline   Madam Corvax Icon

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Posted 19 October 2004 - 03:16 AM

QUOTE (Owyn @ Oct 19 2004, 02:50 AM)
In fact the more common version of that I've heard is Germany had gun control as well as Hitler supported gun control, where despite next to no understanding of the reasons for hitlers rise to power, they use the common osociation of hitler and fascism and place that next to gun control, therefore making gun control look like a route to facism.

Yes, I know that kind of reasoning. We did it least year during text linguistics classes. We were analyzing the way the language can be twisted to influence people. We had a theoretical example:
John is a democrat. John is a good man.
These sentences suggests the statement “all democrats are good”.

Similarly, if we say
Country A had a law B. Country A was bad..
this suggests that law B is bad. At least that is what whoever makes this statement wants us to think, but it is not logical to derive such conclusions. But it is being done to us all the time.
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#35 User is offline   Owyn Icon

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Posted 19 October 2004 - 03:37 AM

yeh i read something similar to that, i believe i was looking for a way to piss of my brother in an argument, since i cant just beat him anymores : (
In fact it highlighted how nearly everything any popular politicans is a load of bs false argument smile.gif
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#36 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 25 October 2004 - 04:50 PM

I think the argument for automatic weapons (and most weapons in general) for individual protection has been pretty much won by the L&E gun control lobby, so now let me pick apart the political and social argument.

Iraq and the entire middle east have 0 gun control. In the Arabian peninsula a grenade can be bought literally by a child for about as much as a cheeseburger, if that. Assault weapons are plentiful. However most every Arab government is a horrendous dictatorship and became so while the populous was armed to the teeth.

As for defending one's country this is wrong wrong wrong. The honorable Che Guevara teaches us that the only things essential to guerilla warfare is the backing of the people, a lack of peaceful means and a vision for what happens after victory. Weapons are not immediately required.

There were more guns in Iraq before the invasion than there were people but Iraq was still invaded (not conquered mind you) However observe the revolutionary action in Vietnam. The populace was not terribly well armed but, after meeting the three conditions for successful guerilla war, they became well armed.

If the reason to fight is there the people can find armament. The Iraqis did not oppose the American agression one instant sooner because they were well armed. The will is what matters, not the weaponry. For instance, a person may have a gun and therefore be able to rob a bank, but a person who wants to rob a bank needn't have a gun to aid in his decision, for he will procure one.

If the US were invaded or (far more likely) it became necessary for someone (preferably myself) to lead a revolution, the principles of Guerilla warfare as laid out by Dr. Guevara state that the majority of supplies including weapons would be captured in hit and run attacks from the enemy. So no, automatic weapons are in no way essential as a deterrent to foreign invasion or tyranny.

If gun owners and militiamen wish to act in the best interests of their country they would do well to find out what's actually going on in their country and also to stop voting for the redneck candidates who they vote for only because said rednecks offer them shiney new guns to play with, while the democratic candidate espouses silly ideas like food, jobs, healthcare and not dying horribly in a war with the world's Muslims.

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#37 User is offline   Amber-Nicole Icon

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Post icon  Posted 26 October 2004 - 04:14 PM

QUOTE
Actually, Amber, if there are any sane neighbors about, you might even consider some sort of mutual defence alliance >;D


My closest neighbor is my grandma, who isnt home the majority of the time. Many of my other neighbors live all around me, a few miles off, and they're sex offenders. ~wierded out~ dry.gif
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#38 User is offline   Creaux Icon

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Posted 27 October 2004 - 12:16 AM

QUOTE (Amber-Nicole @ Oct 26 2004, 04:14 PM)
QUOTE
Actually, Amber, if there are any sane neighbors about, you might even consider some sort of mutual defence alliance >;D


My closest neighbor is my grandma, who isnt home the majority of the time. Many of my other neighbors live all around me, a few miles off, and they're sex offenders. ~wierded out~ dry.gif

Um, wow. I'll come and guard you if you'll feed me. Yay! a job!
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#39 User is offline   SimeSublime Icon

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Posted 27 October 2004 - 05:33 AM

QUOTE (Amber-Nicole @ Oct 27 2004, 05:14 AM)
QUOTE
Actually, Amber, if there are any sane neighbors about, you might even consider some sort of mutual defence alliance >;D


My closest neighbor is my grandma, who isnt home the majority of the time. Many of my other neighbors live all around me, a few miles off, and they're sex offenders. ~wierded out~ dry.gif

See, this is what I find hard to belive. How is it possible to find a large group of people who are sex offenders(unless your actually in a prison). Perhaps I'm lacking info, but from what I'm hearing there seems to be a serious problem with the social structure around your area. It's this mentality that I propose people oppose.
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#40 User is offline   Just your average movie goer Icon

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Posted 27 October 2004 - 06:19 AM

I just had time to peruse this thread. I'd just like to applause JM's outstanding post. That was a very fine argument you put forward there. I take my hat off to you, sir.
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#41 User is offline   Amber-Nicole Icon

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Post icon  Posted 27 October 2004 - 06:40 AM

Sime, like I said, I'm out in the woods. I only have two other neighbors nearby, a few miles off, both of which happen to be sex offenders. There's also an old farmer guy who lives down the street, but he's really old and stuff and wouldn't be of much help in alot of situations. Sweet guy though. A few of my cats wander down there and hang out on his porch.
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#42 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 27 October 2004 - 05:43 PM

Thanks Movie Goer. Always good to hear good things from people who's opinions I respect.

Amber- I'd suggest just keeping a dog, or perhaps you could look into large cats as some of us don't consider dogs to be stylisticly good for our lives.

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#43 User is offline   Paladin Icon

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Posted 29 October 2004 - 06:08 AM

JM, the NRA is not a racist org, and it wasn't responsible for the first gun laws either. What you saw on Bowling for columbine is more or less a myth... typical for Michael Moore I'd say.

Here's a link for you to chew on.
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Posted 23 February 2008 - 01:23 AM

QUOTE (J m HofMarN @ Oct 16 2004, 10:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Assault weapons allow the people to defend themselves from terrorists. Terrorists are not clever enough to drop by their local wal mart and pick up an assault weapon and even if they were they'd be caught by the form they have to fill out, which includes the question: "Are you a terrorist? Yes or No?"

So you see, assault weapons are a freedom that we must cherish. Just like the right to have weapons grade plutonium and stocks of anthrax in our garage.

Actually if you watched Bowling for Columbine you'd see that the NRA is largely a racist institution and that most gun owners probably believe that their most likely target is a young black male. It's amazing how scared the rulers of this country are that they'll lose power...



Bowling for Columbine has been shown to have deliberate lies in the fictional cartoon like amateur film. You obviously have never seen the actual video from the school surveillance cameras at Columbine, which by the way occurred under the enacted Brady Bill which stopped no gun crimes. The horrible crimes committed at Columbine were made with a bolt action rifle and a shotgun not an “assault weapon.”

A few quotes from those who helped construct the U.S. Constitution.

"When the resolution of enslaving America was formed in Great Britain, the British Parliament was advised by an artful man, who was Governor of Pennsylvania, to disarm the people; that it was the best and most effectual way to enslave them; but that they should do it not openly, but weaken them, and let them sink gradually."..........I ask, who are the Militia? They consist now of the whole people, except a few public officers."
George Mason, Virginia's U.S. Constitution ratification convention, 1788

"Arms in the hands of citizens may be used at individual discretion......in private self defense......"
John Adams; A Defense of the Constitution of the Government of the U.S.A. 471 (1788)

"A Militia, when properly formed, are in fact the people themselves, and include all men capable of bearing arms."
Richard Henry Lee, Additional Letters from the Federal Farmer (1788) at 169

"The people are NOT to be disarmed of their weapons. They are left in full possession of them!"
Zachariah Johnson, 3 Elliot, Debates at 646

"Americans have the right and advantage of being armed, unlike citizens of other countries whose governments are afraid to trust the people with arms."
James Madison

"They that can give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety"
Benjamin Franklin

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#45 User is offline   NVTZ Icon

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Posted 23 February 2008 - 01:46 AM

QUOTE (Creaux @ Oct 16 2004, 09:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Why are a good number of people in my nation mad that the assault weapon ban may be re-instated? Why do these people seem to think that there is any reason whatsoever that they need an ASSAULT weapon? I mean, my uncle owns an m16 and an AK47, I've seen and held them and will agree that they are neat, but on NPr, one fellow admitted that he quit his church, the Methodists, because he heard that they were supporting Kerry. His main beef with Kerry? He wants to reinstate the Assault Weapon Ban.

*sigh*

Komatta na...





What exactly are you calling an Assault weapon? Semi Automatic rifles have always been legal. The "Assault weapons" bans do nothing to stop crimes committed by criminals that break many laws to say nothing of gun laws. All the latest violence in colleges were all committed in so called "gun free zones." Meaning the person committing horrible crimes thinks very little about breaking gun laws or any laws for that matter.

"Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act of depriving a whole nation of it's arms as the blackest."

Mahatma Ghandi, 1927

Turkey established gun control in 1911. From 1915 through 1917, 1.5 MILLION Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

The Soviet Union established gun control in 1929. From 1929 through 1953, 20 MILLION political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Germany established gun control in 1938. From 1939 through 1945, 13 MILLION Jews, Gypsies, homosexuals, the mentally ill, and other "mongrolized" people, were rounded up and exterminated.

China established gun control in 1935. From 1949 through ???, 20 MILLION political dissidents and others, unable to defend themselves, have been rounded up and exterminated.

Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 through 1977, 1 MILLION "educated people", unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 through 1981, 100,000 native Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 through 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.

"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity."

Sigmund Freud




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