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Bit the Bullet DVDs

#1 User is offline   Vwing Icon

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 07:52 PM

Yep, I got em. Man, I'm not even worthy of this forum anymore, I couldn't wait one stinkin day for em smile.gif. But what the hell, it's cool. I'm not going to give an in depth analysis yet, first I'm going to sit down and watch through the entire set of movies to notice all the little tweaks that have been made. However, I did glance at most of the MAJOR changes made, and I will tell you about them now.

1. Greedo-Han - It still sucks. It sucks less, but that's like saying the Devil Rays suck less this year than they did last year. They still suck, and so does this scene.

2. Luke scream - Yes, we may rejoice. Luke's ridiculous scream added in the 1997 edition was edited out of ESB. However, before Luke falls, Lucas ties in Vader to Anakin of the prequels by telling Luke, after revealing that Obi-Wan lied to him, "You see? It really IS all Obi-Wan's fault!"

3. End Celebration(s) in ROTJ - It was bad in the first place, and though the music is good, it's not Star Wars music, and I would much rather have the Ewok music there. Now they have added Naboo, which is shown for literally about 5 seconds (no Gungans), and amazingly, looks exactly the same as it did 30 YEARS BEFORE (more great skill with continuity with George), and they show much more grafitti and people on Coruscant. Also the Jedi Temple and Senate are visible, but the grafitti really covers a bunch of the screen. These additions don't really make the scene any worse, and the grafitti while distracting is an interesting touch, but it's unemotional and pointless, and takes away from our heroes emotions.

4. Hayden - Yep, sorry Sebastian Shaw, you've been replaced by Hayden Christensen. Amazingly, it's worse than originally thought. It's not even the fact that it's Hayden Christensen on the screen, that didn't bother me that much. What's annoying is how FAKE it looks. This is understandable, because Alec Guiness and the Yoda puppet were actually THERE, and could actually make eye contact with Mark Hamill and the rest of the party, thereby seeming to really exist there in their ghostly state. But Christensen, well, first of all, he has no exp​ression, he makes one really awkward smile in the direction of Luke, but clearly not AT Luke because he couldn't SEE Mark Hamill, and just seems entirely out of place with Obi-Wan and Yoda. It's a bad change in the first place, and the fact that it's executed poorly makes this the worst change of ANY of the changes since the SEs in 1997.

5. Emperor's new dialogue to Vader in ESB - Now I love Ian McDiarmid. I think he did a great job in ROTJ, and I think he's one of the only bright spots in the prequels as Palpatine. But he comes off here as wooden, and isn't even creepy like he was in ROTJ. His face looks very strange and out of place, and they stupidly show you his entire face, with fewer wrinkles than in ROTJ but with every detail of his face clean, sharp, and visible, instead of leaving you with the aura of mysteriousness that you got from the original Emperor's mostly hidden face. The dialogue is similar. Some of the new dialogue sucks. Emperor says, "There is a great disturbance in the Force. I have no doubt that the young rebel who destroyed the Death Star is the offspring of Anakin Skywalker." Vader says "How is that possible," revealing either that he doesn't know he had kids, or that he hides the fact that he does know from the Emperor, which I must admit is kind of intriguing and fits in with what he says to Luke later. But then comes the worst new dialogue ever. Emperor says "Search your feelings, Lord Vader. You will know it to be true." Hmm. Where have I heard that before? Someone said it, a long time ago, when Lucas could actually write. I can't think who, or when, or...wait it's coming to me. Oh right. Vader said it, in the SAME FUCKING MOVIE! All in all, this is an unnecessary change that turns out to be WORSE than unnecessary because of stupid new dialogue, a surprisingly wooden delivery from McDiarmid, and a revelation of the entirety of the Emperor's face, which, in hologram form, just looks very stupid.

6. Minor changes - Boba Fett is now the Crocodile Hunter and has no menace in him whatsoever (many of his lines are actually overracted by Morrison instead of being subtle, menacing, and cool). Not a big deal, but annoying nevertheless. Some new effects have been added. One I'm not sure is new, but is cool if it is, is when an asteroid hits the bridge of a Star Destroyer, and the next scene you see Vader talking to his captains via their holograms, and one of the holograms looks up in surprise, covers his face, and then fades away as the bridge is destroyed. The Executor seems to have more fire in its engines, and when the death star II is blowing up as we see after Luke's shuttle lifting off, there are more internal and external explosions and more fire. One thing that was odd to me, and I don't know if it's true or not, was that the Death Star II run when they get to the reactor core is VERY, VERY blue, and it just seemed disconcerting and off to me. Again, maybe this was my TV, or it was always like this and I never noticed because the grain of video took away the vibrance of the blue, but it was just very annoyingly blue. I'm sure there are more changes like this, I'll tell you when I watch all of them in their entireties.

Oh I also watched the Episode III preview on Darth Vader, which was interesting to watch, the fight seems like it will be a combination of the fast-paced action of the TPM duel and the grittiness of the OT duels, as there were times when Obi and Ani would get dirty and throw punches and kicks. It looked pretty good. Also, I watched the Making of the Episode III Video Game, where you play as Anakin or Obi and take part in the duel among other things, which again, featured mostly swordfighting, it was interesting, but I would've liked to have seen more of the actual game. And I watched the original teasers and launch trailers of the 3 movies, and I have to tell you, they are hilarious. They're enormously cool and great and all, but they are just so funny to watch. The lightsabers are literally white sticks because the effects hadn't been done yet, and there are obviously some scenes that got deleted or changed, and it's just so great. But I'll get back to you on the rest.
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#2 User is offline   Stongbah Icon

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 08:53 PM

At least you've satisfied your curiosity and got a nice set of cool looking coasters.
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#3 User is offline   Laura Icon

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 09:06 PM

Now what will happen when the PT fades out of existence but the "new improved" DVDs are all a person can get of star wars? And we try to show them to the next generation?

"Aunt Laura, who's that smarmy guy standing with Obi-Wan and Yoda?"

Hopefully the Original OT will come out in the next 20 years... if not, that's one cultural experience ruined for all time.

Won't somebody think of the children!
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#4 User is offline   barend Icon

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 09:21 PM

fuck, man, i don't know where to start...

a video game where you can be anikan or obi wan dueling...

what's the point of that if anikan is goin to slip over and loose anyway?

>>>"You see? It really IS all Obi-Wan's fault!"

uh, luke never heard him say that the first time... but i assume that you were joking on that one... if not it makes no sense...

>>>"There is a great disturbance in the Force. I have no doubt that the >>>young rebel who destroyed the Death Star is the offspring of >>>Anakin Skywalker." Vader says "How is that possible," revealing >>>either that he doesn't know he had kids, or that he hides the fact >>>that he does know from the Emperor

great!!! so one of the biggest plot twists in cinematic history, with one of the most famous lines of all time has now been undermined by a digitally added spoiler!!!

Awsome just awsome....

Why not digitally alter the Crying Game so that the 'girl' has his penis showing in everyshot leading up to the 'twist'

fuck, man!!! i can't believe he's allowed to do this... he's turning a good movie into a shit one... and don't give me that 'artist right' bukllshit either... i don't give a flying fuck who he is... there should be a law against this kind of shit... if not, why don't i just redo my assignments from 1993 and improve my grades from highschool?
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to any one who says he has the right to do this i say FUCK YOU! you're worse than he is!!!
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#5 User is offline   Vwing Icon

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 09:34 PM

Um, Barend, of course it was a joke, and I actually thought it was a decent one, but I guess it wasn't. And listen guys, again, the changes don't detract from my enjoyment of the movies except for those brief intervals (and yes, thankfully they are brief). The heart of the movies is basically still intact.

Oh and an update for JYAMG and Civ on my ESB/ROTJ feelings. I'm going to watch them on the same day back to back to see what I think once and for all, comparing the two. So we'll see. But I'm certainly leaning more toward ESB than I ever have before in my life.

EDIT: FFGA FFGAF (This is actually a reminder for myself, pay no attention to it, it literally has nothing to do with anything. Don't ask questions about it, don't think about it, it's there just for me to remind me of something that I can't forget before I write it down permanently in a couple of days).

This post has been edited by Vwing: 21 September 2004 - 09:38 PM

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#6 User is offline   barend Icon

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 09:45 PM

and a good joke it was, but believable at this point asswell...
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#7 User is offline   Just your average movie goer Icon

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Posted 22 September 2004 - 12:22 AM

QUOTE
And listen guys, again, the changes don't detract from my enjoyment of the movies except for those brief intervals (and yes, thankfully they are brief).


They don't detract from your enjoyment, are you absolutely sure? They would irritate the hell out of me and once they'd taken place, the rest of my movie experience would be tainted by bitter thoughts.

Nice to hear you're going to watch The Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi back to back. This is where you will most clearly feel the difference. I think you'll be amazed.
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#8 User is offline   HK 47 Icon

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Posted 22 September 2004 - 03:47 AM

QUOTE
2. Luke scream - Yes, we may rejoice. Luke's ridiculous scream added in the 1997 edition was edited out of ESB. However, before Luke falls, Lucas ties in Vader to Anakin of the prequels by telling Luke, after revealing that Obi-Wan lied to him, "You see? It really IS all Obi-Wan's fault!"


I hate nr 2.

QUOTE
6. Minor changes One thing that was odd to me, and I don't know if it's true or not, was that the Death Star II run when they get to the reactor core is VERY, VERY blue, and it just seemed disconcerting and off to me. Again, maybe this was my TV, or it was always like this and I never noticed because the grain of video took away the vibrance of the blue, but it was just very annoyingly blue.


Rejoice, for the Gungan blue ball has been found!! The empire stole it from Naboo and fertilized it to make it grow to become the reactor for Death Star 2! Thanks George, brilliant!!
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Posted 22 September 2004 - 04:35 AM

QUOTE (barend @ Sep 21 2004, 09:21 PM)
>>>"There is a great disturbance in the Force. I have no doubt that the >>>young rebel who destroyed the Death Star is the offspring of >>>Anakin Skywalker." Vader says "How is that possible," revealing >>>either that he doesn't know he had kids, or that he hides the fact >>>that he does know from the Emperor

great!!! so one of the biggest plot twists in cinematic history, with one of the most famous lines of all time has now been undermined by a digitally added spoiler!!!

It sounds like a dumb scene, and stupid and all that, but it's not technically a spoiler. He doesn't say "The son of Darth Vader," so there's still a chance we're not supposed to know Vader = Skywalker and the revelation will still be shocking.

Of course, if we learn in ROTS that Anikin = Vader, then it'll really come as no shock when we learn the two characters are realted. They share a last name!
"I had a lot of different ideas. At one point, Luke, Leia and Ben were all going to be little people, and we did screen tests to see if we could do that." -George Lucas, in STAR WARS: the Annotated Screenplays (p197).
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#10 User is offline   Paladin Icon

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Posted 22 September 2004 - 07:32 AM

QUOTE
why don't i just redo my assignments from 1993 and improve my grades from highschool?


umm... I'm going to do a few recourses in the next semiester to improve the grades that I got in my Freshman year of college!! blink.gif huh.gif
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#11 User is offline   Chefelf Icon

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Posted 22 September 2004 - 08:29 AM

QUOTE (Laura @ Sep 21 2004, 10:06 PM)
Hopefully the Original OT will come out in the next 20 years... if not, that's one cultural experience ruined for all time.

I don't think an officially approved Lucasfilm version will. I'm sure some brave pirates will sell DVDs of the original, but they'll probably be hunted down by Lucasfilm Death Squads.

QUOTE
>>>"There is a great disturbance in the Force. I have no doubt that the >>>young rebel who destroyed the Death Star is the offspring of >>>Anakin Skywalker." Vader says "How is that possible," revealing >>>either that he doesn't know he had kids, or that he hides the fact >>>that he does know from the Emperor


Why is he surprised? Hasn't he begun the movie SPECIFICALLY looking for Luke? Doesn't he know his last name is "Skywalker"? This is inexcuseable!

QUOTE (Empire Strikes Back)
EPISODE V
THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK

It is a dark time for the
Rebellion. Although the Death
Star has been destroyed,
Imperial troops have driven the
Rebel forces from their hidden
base and pursued them across
the galaxy.

Evading the dreaded Imperial
Starfleet, a group of freedom
fighters led by Luke Skywalker
has established a new secret
base on the remote ice world
of Hoth.

The evil Lord Darth Vader,
obsessed with finding young
Skywalker, has dispatched
thousands of remote probes into
the far reaches of space...


It's right there!!!! yell.gif yell.gif yell.gif yell.gif
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#12 User is offline   Despondent Icon

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Posted 22 September 2004 - 08:52 AM

Well it was. dry.gif


Vwing, have they tinkered with the opening crawl? (with a noticeably different typeface perhaps?)
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#13 User is offline   Chefelf Icon

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Posted 22 September 2004 - 10:04 AM

The new opening crawl:

QUOTE
EPISODE V
THE EMPIRE STRIKES BACK

It is a dark time for the
Rebellion. Although the Death
Star has been destroyed,
Imperial troops have driven the
Rebel forces from their hidden
base and pursued them across
the galaxy.

Evading the dreaded Imperial
Starfleet, a group of freedom
fighters led by Luke Skywalker
has established a new secret
base on the remote ice world
of Hoth.

The evil Lord Darth Vader,
obsessed with finding young

Skywalker,
has dispatched
thousands of remote probes into
the far reaches of space...

See Chefelf in a Movie! -> The People vs. George Lucas

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#14 User is offline   Vwing Icon

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Posted 22 September 2004 - 11:51 AM

I'll go check it out about the crawl I didn't watch it, I'm sure they didn't. But actually that line, though badly worded, as I said, doesn't bother me too much. It does add a couple semi-interesting things.

1. Vader never knew he had kids, heard the name Skywalker, was curious about it so he was obsessed with finding how they were related, and then is genuinely surprised when it is confirmed that Luke is his son.

2. Vader knows about Luke, and is hiding this information from the Emperor, so that, as he says to Luke later, they can overthrow Palpatine and rule the galaxy as father and son.

Is it a stupid and meaningless thing to put in? Yeah. But it can be explained by this, and I really don't think I'm stretching at all to explain them. But again the thing that bothered me, just because of the writing aspect was that the Emperor actually says to Vader: SEARCH YOUR FEELINGS, LORD VADER. YOU WILL KNOW IT TO BE TRUE. So this just takes away all of the impact we feel hearing Vader deliver the line, because we already heard it from the Emperor in the SAME MOVIE!
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#15 User is offline   barend Icon

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Posted 22 September 2004 - 05:24 PM

i think i speak for most of us here when i say:

BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
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