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D.STAR DESTRUCTION=COLLAPSE OF EMP lucas F/UP again, didnt figure GALAXY GP

#1 User is offline   prisonerofbusch Icon

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Posted 20 August 2004 - 09:52 PM

:angry: :angry: :angry: thats GALAXY GROSS PRODUCT...lucas shows his ass again in the failure to grasp basic economic laws...lets say for example a star fareing civilazation had warp technology...and advance AI tech and other extoic stuff...if lucas "in his star wars universe " projects a 30 year job order for death star 1 and 2 ( we assume that a sister ship would be built, either due to possible systen failure and or an attack or a labor dispute that would cripple or destroy one sphere and this at another location ) and shortly after one deployment, its ablitiy to accomplish its mission ( destroying alderran ) and that it works...the people who funded this would be greatly pleased...remember UNION WORKERS DIDNT BUILD THE DEATH STARS...IT WAS MORE THAN LIKELY SLAVE POOL LAB0R, AND UNDER THE COSTANT THREAT OF PAIN OR DEATH...if the quality of the work was not up to imperial standards...after 30 years of death stars 1 and 2 , this would have been an gaint out lay of money time and personnel to the empire to create these weapons...then shortly after one deployment it was destroyed by rebels flying out dated weapon systems and destroyed by some minor flaw, HEADS WOULD HAVE ROLLED...I DONT CARE HOW POWERFUL VADER OR PALPTAINE OR GRAND MOFF TARKIN WAS ARE WHO THEY KNEW...THE TRUE MILATARY LEADER OF THE EMPIRE WOULD HAVE BEEN REALLING AND REVOLTING AFTER THE DESTRUCTION OF DEATH STAR AND THE PEOPLE WHO BACKED THE PROJECT ALL THAT MONEY ECT DOWN THE DRAIN MAN THEY BE MORE PISSED OFF THAN THE MILATARY ...NOT SO MUCH VADER HE TOLD THE HIGH OFFICERS NOT TO BOAST ABOUT THE WEAPON, BUT PALPTAINE HIS ASS WOULD HAVE BEEN KILLED HANDS DOWN 24 HOURS AFTER DEATH STAR ONE DESTRUCTION...THE ECONOMIC SHOCK WAVES THAT WOULD BE SENT THUR THE EMPIRE WOULD HAVE BEEN ENOUGH TO BRING ABOUT A GALAXY DARK AGE....no lucas should have went with the economic shock wave wrecking havok on the empire, with vader as a strong person forging the empire anew...this would have worked much better dovetailing into EP 6...vader could have been even more appealing to both the movie goer and to luke being tempted by the dark side...VADER TRYING TO BRING ORDER OUT OF CHAOS...VADER JUST DOING HIS JOB, VADER WARING AGAINST TO MUCH DEPENDENCE ON WMD, VADER TRYING TO PREVENT A DARK AGE IN THE KNOWN GALAXY DUE TO ECONOMIC COLLAPSE AND MILATARY INSURRECTION, VADER AS FATHER AND SON ( AS MENTION IN EP 5 ) END ONCE AND FOR ALL THE WARS , VADER THE MAN OF THE HOUR, ...ALAS ALAS ALAS, LUCAS FUCKED IT UP...I HOPE THAT SOME WAY SOME HOW LUCAS GET WIND OF HOW MUCH THE FAN BASE HATES HIM FOR MESSING UP THE FRANCHISE... :angry: :angry: :angry:
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#2 User is offline   Jordan Icon

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Posted 21 August 2004 - 05:56 AM

You're taking down the whole system. Write in small paragraphs and don't Start so many threads!
Oh SMEG. What the smeggity smegs has smeggins done? He smeggin killed me. - Lister of Smeg, space bum
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#3 User is offline   Just your average movie goer Icon

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Posted 21 August 2004 - 08:20 AM

Agreed. Yes, please stop making so many threads. For one thing, you're pushing lots of good hot topics onto the second and third page. All your points could have been posted under one thread, with a title like "Why George Lucas is an idiot.", for example.

Okay, having said that, I like your point about the Death Star. I personally thought having two of the things was an awful move -

1. Because it's so damn implausable, especially in the time frame between Star Wars and Return of the Jedi.

and

2. It was recycling an old idea and when there's only three movies, recylcing something like that leaves one with a very large sense of deja vu.


I hate Lucas' recycling ideas. Now he is recycling characters, making everyone who could have conceivably existed at the time of prequels crop up. We had Jabba the Hutt, a young Greedo and a ten year old Boba Fett, Artoo and Threepio and now we're going to get Chewbacca in Episode III (and no doubt we'll learn that Lando Calrissian is Mace Windu's nephew ). And it is awful.

Every time, Lucas does this, the Star Wars galaxy gets smaller. Now it's like a small country town with a population of 80.

"Oh, do you know R2-D2?"

"Yeah. He's a good droid. He worked for my mother, Amidala."

"Amidala? Oh, she's one of my godparents."

"Really? Who's the other one?"

"Chewbacca."

"Oh, Chewbacca. He's hanging around with that young Solo boy, isn't he?"

"Solo? Oh yeah. He's that guy who's friends with Mace Windu's nephew."


It's terrible.
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#4 User is offline   Just your average movie goer Icon

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Posted 21 August 2004 - 08:26 AM

Also, it sounds like you're not the biggest fan of Return of the Jedi... and that wins you points, in my book.

I'd like to refer you to Geaorge Lucarse - the woo maker..., a thread which is currently on the 6th page of this forum. It starts out talking about Lucas' terrible attempts at writing romantic dialogue in the prequels...

... and somehow turned into the greatest debate on the merits of Return of the Jedi that we've had on this forum (and we've had quite a few). Eventually, the forum was locked because it had turned into such a war. So you can't post any new replies to it.

But if you don't like Return of the Jedi, like myself, then I think you will probably really enjoy reading that thread. cool.gif
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#5 User is offline   Helena Icon

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Posted 21 August 2004 - 09:40 AM

QUOTE (Just your average movie goer @ Aug 21 2004, 02:20 PM)
I hate Lucas' recycling ideas.  Now he is recycling characters, making everyone who could have conceivably existed at the time of prequels crop up.  We had Jabba the Hutt, a young Greedo and a ten year old Boba Fett, Artoo and Threepio and now we're going to get Chewbacca in Episode III (and no doubt we'll learn that Lando Calrissian is Mace Windu's nephew ).  And it is awful.

Every time, Lucas does this, the Star Wars galaxy gets smaller.  Now it's like a small country town with a population of 80. 

"Oh, do you know R2-D2?"

"Yeah.  He's a good droid.  He worked for my mother, Amidala."

"Amidala?  Oh, she's one of my godparents."

"Really?  Who's the other one?"

"Chewbacca."

"Oh, Chewbacca.  He's hanging around with that young Solo boy, isn't he?"

"Solo?  Oh yeah.  He's that guy who's friends with Mace Windu's nephew."


It's terrible.

LOL! Yes, I totally agree. Lucas seems to forget that the story he's writing takes place across an entire galaxy - the odds against most of the OT characters having known each other previously must be astronomical (literally!). Honestly, how likely is it that Anakin would have grown up with Greedo, or that Boba Fett's father was the original 'Clone' and once fought Obi-Wan Kenobi? All I can say is, there had better not be any truth in the rumour that Anakin is Palpatine's illegitimate son.
QUOTE
The sandpeople had women and children. We know this because Anakin killed them how could he tell? The children might be smaller but I never saw a sandperson with breasts. Did they hike their skirts and show him some leg or something?

QUOTE
Also, I can see the point of wanting to kidnap a human and use her as a slave, but they didn't. They tied her to a flimsy easel for a month. It's assumed they had to feed and give her water. What for? Was she purely ornamental? I can understand them wanting the droids, you can sell those for a lot of money, but a chick who's only skills are finding non-existand mushrooms and getting randomly pregnant, you're not going to get much.

- J m HofMarN on the Sand People
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#6 User is offline   Jordan Icon

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Posted 21 August 2004 - 09:56 AM

QUOTE
Every time, Lucas does this, the Star Wars galaxy gets smaller. Now it's like a small country town with a population of 80. 



That's the best way of putting it. The SW universe has become a drama series on HBO. It's about the lives of some people from a small town. Not the events that take place in an infinite galaxy.

Sure you need to have main characters. BUt to have every character pop up is just absurd.
Oh SMEG. What the smeggity smegs has smeggins done? He smeggin killed me. - Lister of Smeg, space bum
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#7 User is offline   Just your average movie goer Icon

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Posted 21 August 2004 - 10:55 AM

QUOTE
Lucas seems to forget that the story he's writing takes place across an entire galaxy - the odds against most of the OT characters having known each other previously must be astronomical (literally!).


Exactly! Thanks Helena and Jordan for backing me up on that one.


QUOTE
All I can say is, there had better not be any truth in the rumour that Anakin is Palpatine's illegitimate son.


I don't know. I wouldn't put anything past George Lucas at this point.
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#8 User is offline   barend Icon

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 04:51 AM

QUOTE (Just your average movie goer @ Aug 21 2004, 08:26 AM)
I'd like to refer you to Geaorge Lucarse - the woo maker..., a thread which is currently on the 6th page of this forum. It starts out talking about Lucas' terrible attempts at writing romantic dialogue in the prequels...

... and somehow turned into the greatest debate on the merits of Return of the Jedi that we've had on this forum (and we've had quite a few). Eventually, the forum was locked because it had turned into such a war. So you can't post any new replies to it.

yeah, thanks again for changing the subject and getting that one torn down, guys...

tongue.gif

anyway...

personally i think comparitivly ROTJ was the weakest, but acceptable enough...

as for a second deathstar... i could only assume that droids built it.
the taxpayers funded that one...

and if some little jerk destroyed it i would build another one two...
'cept MY second one would have just been the primary weapon, a seat, and a joystick, and cupholder. and i would arbitrarily exterminated all rebellion affiliated planets...
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#9 User is offline   Just your average movie goer Icon

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 05:28 AM

That is fantastic, especially the part about the cup holder. cool.gif
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#10 User is offline   thrawn Icon

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 09:12 AM

Hi i'm new. Ive been reading all of the posts by you guys for the past 2 months and I totally agree with you prequal haters, 100%. I consider myself a real diehard fan, I can name many plantets, characters, and events in the SW universe,
I am really up the wall with my SW knowledge, and really really hate the prequals they are absolute shite!! it is an embarrasment that it carries the name of Star Wars. I am very much into the EU, I think it gives more depth to the SW universe and I think the books and the comics are a very important part of SW. Anyway, what i'm trying to say is that it really pisses me of that Lucas completey ignores the EU in the prequals, he keeps creating new races and new planets that we havn't seen or heard off. i mean, why can't he use any of the existing races planets or even characters. Therefore it can all link together and seem more obvious. for example instead of using Naboo he could of used Chandrila or some other planet. i mean hes got all this existing SW material and he doesn't even bother to use it.
As to your posts on how the SW universe has become seemingly small because of Lucas making all these links to each of the popular characters I totally agree, its very stupid, especially the inclusion of Boba and Jango Fett, God!! that pissed me of so much and it was probably the prime reason why hated AOTC. I mean if you want to have logical links you should include important characters like Grand Moff Tarkin, I think he needs a fair part in all of this, I mean Vader took orders from him for Gods sake!!!
Overall i am a big time prequal hater and I dread the release of the upcoming Episode II, although in a way I am hoping that it turns out to be an acceptble film because this is when we get to see Anikan transform into vader, but that hope is very small.
And after reading your posts and The Reasons To Hate the Prequals (absolutely Hilarious!!) I was able to get some closure on the horrors i have witnessed.

Anyway, thats all I have to say for now and sorry if my English isn't that good (coz i'm 15). Keep up with the good posts!! I'll be looking forward to reading them.
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#11 User is offline   Helena Icon

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 10:31 AM

Welcome thrawn! It's nice to have another recruit to the cause. I'm not sure that everyone here would agree with you about the EU, but there is a general consensus here that Naboo should have been Alderaan - Padme is Leia's mother, after all.

And your English is fine. smile.gif
QUOTE
The sandpeople had women and children. We know this because Anakin killed them how could he tell? The children might be smaller but I never saw a sandperson with breasts. Did they hike their skirts and show him some leg or something?

QUOTE
Also, I can see the point of wanting to kidnap a human and use her as a slave, but they didn't. They tied her to a flimsy easel for a month. It's assumed they had to feed and give her water. What for? Was she purely ornamental? I can understand them wanting the droids, you can sell those for a lot of money, but a chick who's only skills are finding non-existand mushrooms and getting randomly pregnant, you're not going to get much.

- J m HofMarN on the Sand People
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#12 User is offline   Just your average movie goer Icon

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 10:31 AM

Welcome aboard, Thrawn. Judging by your username, it sounds as if you're a fan of my favourite piece of the Extended Universe.

Yes, it is puzzling as to why George Lucas would not take advantage of the great wealth of material that has been left at his disposal by far better writers....

perhaps it is a variation of something I call 'little man syndrome', which is where somebody who is not much in the scheme of things tries to throw their weight around too much - like (for example) taking full creative control of a movie trilogy that half the world has been anticipating for over a decade.

Anyway, good to see fresh faces on the board. Glad you've enjoyed reading the posts. You've come to the right place.

This post has been edited by Just your average movie goer: 24 August 2004 - 10:33 AM

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#13 User is offline   HK 47 Icon

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 10:34 AM

Welcome Thrawn, nice choice of avatar.

The EU vs. Lucas vision hasn't been discussed much here at all. But it is a difficult issue. Even if Lucas was a great writer and director I don't think he should be limited to what the EU says. If a EU creator writes about the main characters or plots before or after the OT, odds are good that Lucas will contradict it. Ah hell, he'll even contradict himself on some major issues. But it has been proven time and again that some EU writers outclass Lucas by a mile...

Oh, and you do write better than you think. smile.gif
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#14 User is offline   Just your average movie goer Icon

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 10:55 AM

The reason why the Extended Universe is a somewhat difficult issue is because Lucasfilm and the publishing company Bantam basically seemed to publish any author that put "Star Wars" in front of his or her manuscript, including the dreadful Kevin J. Anderson.

For those who haven't read Kevin J. Anderson's novels (firstly, don't), his stories are a lot like the kinds of stories that we might have written when we were five.

His contributions to Star Wars include a full size, working Death Star prototype...
honestly, if a full size prototype worked, why wouldn't you build the interior sections and make your finished model out of it?

This Death Star prototype could be piloted like a speeder bike. In charge of the looking after the prototype was an incompetent alien. Seeing how the Emperor hates incompetence and he hates aliens, it seems very strange that this would be the guy he'd put in charge of this.

He also had a Sun Crusher, which was invulnerable because of QUANTUM ARMOUR (whatever the hell that means).... and this blew up STARS! Wo-hoo! Way to go, Kevin!

He also introduced a female Imperial Admiral who was a tactical genius. We know she's a tactical genius because Kevin told us so... however, I was a bit confused as to why she lost a Star Destroyer in each book (culminating in the loss of a Super Star Destroyer in a later one).

Let's see... what else... in that later one, he also had the Hutts try to build a super laser like the Death Star and call it a DARKSABER. Hutts building super weapons? DARKSABER...

I just realised that Lucas took one idea from the Extended Universe (from the worst possible source) - playing up the Hutts as a whole race that controlled many planets and were bent on taking over the galaxy. I kind of thought that Jabba was just an odd one out - and that perhaps an entire race wasn't made up of evil megalomaniacs.

Kevin is also responsible for trying to prevent Luke from participating in future stories by making him start a Jedi ACADEMY ... on Yavin 4, of all places.

I liked the idea of Jedi being trained in secluded spots one-on-one. Having a Jedi college, or an academy, was a poor idea...

... and hey! Another one Lucas borrowed.

I don't know where this rant is going so I better stop and summarise.

1. Not all the Extended Edition stuff is good. Some of it is brilliant, like anything written by Timothy Zahn, and some of it is absolutely ridiculous and childish... like EVERYTHING written by Kevin J. Dickinson.

2. And George Lucas did use some ideas from the Extended Universe. He found the work from the most amateur and immature author who contributed to the novels, and used that.


LAST POINT -

Star Wars had a chance to live, breathe and jump again... but idiots, such as George Lucas, (who should be put against a wall and shot), missed the chance.

Obviously, I'm talking about making movie versions of Timothy Zahn's trilogy. That would have cemented Star Wars in the hearts and minds of movie goers like myself for another twenty years at least. It would have been breathtaking... and unlike the original trilogy, it would have been flawless as it had a worthy conclusion for its third component.

However, this window of opportunity was a short one. This had to be done right after the novels were released and not a moment later. You've all seen our original Star Wars actors. You've seen how they've been ageing.

It is because they were getting old so quickly that these movies had to be made back then.

It was a narrow window and the people at Lucasfilm are fools for not taking advantage of it while they could.

This post has been edited by Just your average movie goer: 24 August 2004 - 11:04 AM

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#15 User is offline   Rory Icon

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Posted 24 August 2004 - 01:55 PM

QUOTE
I'd like to refer you to Geaorge Lucarse - the woo maker..., a thread which is currently on the 6th page of this forum. It starts out talking about Lucas' terrible attempts at writing romantic dialogue in the prequels...

... and somehow turned into the greatest debate on the merits of Return of the Jedi that we've had on this forum (and we've had quite a few). Eventually, the forum was locked because it had turned into such a war. So you can't post any new replies to it.

But if you don't like Return of the Jedi, like myself, then I think you will probably really enjoy reading that thread.


I'd refer you to my arguments on the same thread about why ROTJ is actually a pretty neat movie; they might just give you a few things to think about. biggrin.gif
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