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The Phantom Edit have any of you seen this????

#1 User is offline   Esco Icon

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Posted 10 August 2004 - 12:10 PM

I recently downloaded this from a "anonymous" peer-to-peer software.
My thoughts? Well, I was actually quite impressed with the results. Very professional quality cuts and edits all around, and a amazing amount of JarJar was removed flawlessly.
TPE's plot and story progresses at a brisk pace, quite the opposite from TPM's snail pacing. It seemed like I was watching a whole new upgraded movie. I was actually enjoying watching Episode I!!! I cant believe it!

The Phantom Menace: **out of *****
The Phantom Edit: ****out of *****

This post has been edited by Esco: 10 August 2004 - 12:11 PM

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Posted 10 August 2004 - 12:33 PM

I've heard of The Phantom Edit before. I'd love to see it one day.
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#3 User is offline   Chefelf Icon

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Posted 10 August 2004 - 02:45 PM

I got really excited when I heard about the Phantom Edit back when it was first released (in 2001, I believe). I quickly downloaded it and I must say that I just wasn't that impressed. Was it better? Marginally. However, it further supports my theory that this movie can't be fixed simply by editing. It needs an entire redo. There isn't enough in there to work with simply by editing.
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#4 User is offline   Esco Icon

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Posted 10 August 2004 - 03:48 PM

come on, Chef. You at least got to admit that the pacing was much better.
I can agree with what you say about needing a total redo, but for what its worth, I thought it was vastly improved. I wasnt bored to death within the first 20 minutes,
which is what happens if I attempt to view the original.
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Posted 10 August 2004 - 04:24 PM

Sure, it's an improvement, however it's like painting a turd with beautiful brushstrokes and gold flakes. Underneath it's still a turd. It still appears turdlike and smells. rolleyes.gif
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#6 User is offline   Esco Icon

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Posted 10 August 2004 - 04:30 PM

Boy, do you have a way with analogies.
Point well taken.
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Posted 10 August 2004 - 04:33 PM

QUOTE (Esco @ Aug 10 2004, 05:30 PM)
Boy, do you have a way with analogies.
Point well taken.

I've done a lot of thinking on this particular subject. wink.gif
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Posted 10 August 2004 - 07:04 PM

True - an awful movie can't be saved by editing. I'd just like to see it to see what all the fuss is about.
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#9 User is offline   barend Icon

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Posted 10 August 2004 - 10:06 PM

editing is a highly underated practice...

good or bad, it can easily make the difference between a truley wonderfull movie and a trully crap one... seriously

i agree that TPM needs to start from scratch...
but a decent B-movie could be procured from the footage i'm sure.

so i hope i find this...
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#10 User is offline   Madam Corvax Icon

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Posted 11 August 2004 - 12:23 AM

QUOTE (barend @ Aug 10 2004, 10:06 PM)
editing is a highly underated practice...

good or bad, it can easily make the difference between a truley wonderfull movie and a trully crap one... seriously

Those are the words of a prophet. I cannot agree more. Look at LOTR trilogy. The same director, three different editors. Result - the first part is a work of a genius, the third part is a just choppy collage of breathtaking images. I think I will start a thread on that in the film section some time ...
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Posted 11 August 2004 - 12:31 AM

I will happily join on that one, Madam Corvax. If you look around there, you'll find that I've posted quite a number of rants on the subject.
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#12 User is offline   DistantAngel Icon

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Posted 11 August 2004 - 03:52 AM

QUOTE (Madam Corvax @ Aug 11 2004, 12:23 AM)
Those are the words of a prophet. I cannot agree more. Look at LOTR trilogy. The same director, three different editors. Result - the first part is a work of a genius, the third part is a just choppy collage of breathtaking images. I think I will start a thread on that in the film section some time ...


That's a true enough sentiment, I think, editing can significantly alter a film somewhat, although I don't think it can make crap out gold and vice versa. "The Phantom Edit" may speed up the pacing and remove Jar Jar, but it doesn't fix the underlying problems with the film itself - it merely trims the excess fat and tidies it up a little. Similarly, the theatrical cut of ROTK is choppy, but that doesn't detract too much from the fact that it's a stunning and well-executed film - it just makes the seams a little obvious and often leaves scenes in an unsatisfying way.

And, in defence of ROTK, the reason it's choppy is not really to do with the editor, Jamie Selkirk. Most of Peter Jackson's other films were edited by Selkirk, and they don't really suffer in the same way. Not only that, but Jackson kept (as he has with all his films) a relatively good eye on the editing - he would always sit in on as many edit sessions as he could, especially with the LOTR trilogy to ensure that, although each film would be different in tone, the style would remain consistent throughout.

The main reason ROTK feels hasty in its editing is because it was rushed. Due to time constraints, Jackson had to deliver five minutes of completed film per day in the run up to release, and that meant that he didn't get to see the entire completed film until the premiere, and I think it's that that caused the problems with the edit. He may have seen every completed scene, but he didn't see the completed film, and that's something a director must have; the scenes themselves may work, but they can often feel out of place when taken in context with the scenes immediately before and after.
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#13 User is offline   Madam Corvax Icon

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Posted 11 August 2004 - 04:53 AM

Distant Angel, thanks for the post. I would love to bicker with you on the merits of ROTK. But as I said, I do not really want to start discussion here, this is SW forum. But please look up the Movie section for discussion of ROTK soon. I will definitely start the thread.
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Posted 11 August 2004 - 06:43 AM

It sounds like it will be a lot of fun. cool.gif But if Distant Angel is right about that stuff with the time constraints, then the people to blame for Return of the King's inferiority are the head honchos at New Line.
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#15 User is offline   DistantAngel Icon

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Posted 11 August 2004 - 10:26 AM

Oh, I don't want to bicker either, Madam C ... this, as you quite rightly say, is an SW forum, and as such I try to keep LOTR talk to an absolute minimum. This, then, should be the last thing I say on the subject before I go back to tormenting my voodoo doll with the beard and flannel shirt smile.gif

The reason for Jackson's lack of time to edit ROTK is Jackson himself. Just as he did with TTT, he kept tinkering with the cut of the film past the point at which he should have a lock done. With ROTK, he really pushed his luck. The time constraints were due simply because there were only X days until the final cut would be needed to begin making all the prints from. The date was absolutely fixed, and could not be moved (to do so would overshoot the release date, and no one can afford to do that).

New Line did the math and, working backwards from that date, told Jackson that he had no choice but to turn over something like 5 minutes of completed film per day to ensure that enough time was available to produce the 10,000 or so prints needed to go to cinemas around the world. If he didn't, the film would not be released on 17th December as scheduled, and that would be very bad - an awful lot of distributors, promotors, sponsors, and others who have money invested would quite probably lynch a director for pulling that trick.

So, ultimately, it is Peter Jackson's fault smile.gif Anyway, back to the SW discussion smile.gif
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