[MyPantsAreOnFire]

Personally, I can't hear any innovation in Bleach. It's a decent album, but it mostly sounds, to me, like a bunch of Melvins and Mudhoney b-sides. I think the attempt to make the music more "catchy" with the next album is the innovation...marrying the musical sensibilities of the Pixies with 70's punk and catchy power pop melodies was something that nobody had done before, or if they had, not nearly as well.

But, not everyone is going to like the same stuff. Vive la difference.

[Chyld]

God damnit man, how can you NOT pull out the old air guitar when Smells like Teen Spirit comes on?

By a cunning method I call "hearing it in every damn club I go to, while the owners think 'that'll satiate the rock kids, now lets put more shitty pop on'"

See also: Basket Case, American Idiot, both by Green Day.

[Jordan]

Shitty POP? All the best Rock bands are pop. Beatles, Oasis, The Who, Rollingstone, Sex Pistols etc...

If you're on the top 40 and have number one hit singles, you're pop!

I think in an attempt to be hip and underground, people often debunk popular music.

[Sailor Abbey]

Rollingstone,

[mireaux7]

If you're on the top 40 and have number one hit singles, you're pop!

Hmm?,.really, did the rules on this recently change?

I recall in the early 1990's, Metallica's Black Album had many singles that were listed in the top 40 Billboards..but they werent classified as pop.

there are many other various examples, this was just one.

[Jordan]

pop just means popular. If you're in the top 40 you're popular.

Spears, Madonna, Backstreetboys, and a ton of 80s artists have attached new meaning to the term, unfairly mind you.

Pop music is confused with the shit above. Because it is popular and does sell well, so bands try get away from the term that don't want to be associated with MTV fame, back up dancing, light shows, and boy bandish appeal.

I don't see pop as a genre of music, but a category of fame. Pop and indie. But stupid people are trying to make them a genre, which just further confuses people.

nobody knows who is what any more. Nirvana was called grunge, thought they were new wave, claimed they wanted to do pop music (pop music is usually 3 chord simple songs with basic structure, thats what most people like, easy music that does not take any deconstructing to understand and doesn't have 10 minute guitar solos)

This post has been edited by Jordan: 07 November 2006 - 02:57 PM

[Slade]

I've always been of the understanding that pop as a genre is when the point of the music is to make dumb, one dimensional catchy songs so that you stay popular and make lots of money. Indie as a genre is basically any band that doesn't suck the cocks of the recording industry giants. As a style, it's assumed that since they're not being pressured to churn out chart-toppers all the time by their label, they're not going to have so many songs that sound exactly like every other top 40s hit of the past 15 years or so.

This stuff has probably been said already, but I only bothered to look at the last three or four posts before I offered my two cents. I think some Nirvana's stuff is fun, but there's no way I'm ever going to be like OMFG MUSICAL GENIUS!!111 about any of it.

Edit: After skimmimg, I must comment that Pearl Jam is a steaming pile of elephant feces. I'm sorry, but there's no nicer way to put it.

blueoceans: Have you ever heard System of A Down? If they digitally altered the lead singer's voice post-production, it wouldn't be the high, whiny, grating, obnoxious one that it is. And they wouldn't let any of them try to sing melodies, either.

Wayne: Kobain has a shitty, grating voice that no one should ever try to imitate (I'm looking at you, Guitar Hero II!), and yet was continually imitated and remains being imitated today as the genre affectionately known as redneck rock. Chris Cornell had a much better voice that showed dynamic and range, and could hold a pitch, at least during the Soundgarden years. Now, he sounds like he spent the last ten years making up two lifetimes of smoking.

Pants: The trouble with "catchiness" is that everyone plays off of the exact same wavelength, which makes all music written to be catchy depressingly boring and formulaic.

[Dr Lecter]

Shitty POP? All the best Rock bands are pop. Beatles, Oasis, The Who, Rollingstone, Sex Pistols etc...

Have you heard anything by the Sex Pistols? Maybe you were listening to another band, and thought it was them. The Sex Pistols were a punk band. I'll give you the rest, apart from the others. Even if other people call them Pop, in my dictactionary- Pop = Shitty stratching wannabe garbage. That statement is:

Shitty SHITTY STRATCHING WANNABE GARBAGE? All the best Rock bands are shitty stratching wannabe garbage. Beatles, Oasis, The Who, Rollingstone, Sex Pistols etc...

And I disgree with your insulting of pretty decent bands.

P.S. You should be ashamed of putting Oasis with such a group anyway. Oasis are shit. I mean, they ARE what I would call a Pop band.

This post has been edited by Dr Lecter: 11 November 2006 - 06:24 AM

[Jordan]

Most people who slag off Oasis can't even name one song aside from Wonderwall. Definately Maybe and Whats the story are amazing CDs. IF you give them a listen to, you'd probably think they're a good rock band.

Sex pistols are legends and were in the mainstream. That's what I"m talking about Pop music is not all bad music. It just means it's popular, if you're not pop then you're indie/underground.

Oasis are not a manfactured Brittney Spears movement. They are from a working class background, Liam is the singer, and NOel writes all the songs. They made it on their own merits. Americans and Canadians don't understand that and hate them because of LIams antics in North America.

People in Vancouver hate Oasis because they walked off a show back in 1995 after having a boot thrown at them, which they warned the crowed "please dont' through shit at us, we're not a punk band that gets off on it".

Live Forever, Supersonic, Roll With it, Listen up, LIttle by little, Columbia, Cigarettes and Alcohol, etc... Listen to those songs on loud and tell me that they suck.

Cobains voice---

By no means a Dean Martin, but it worked for his style of music. His damaged voice is what gave the unplugged CD a haunting beauty to it, that and his death. But it was the gratting disturbed, imperfect flow that made his songs on that CD seem real.

This post has been edited by Jordan: 11 November 2006 - 09:48 PM

[Dr Lecter]

- If Cobain was still alive he would not be as popular as it is. He was not all that special.

- I've heard a lot of Oasis, incase you can't remember, I'm British, and over here Oasis get played everywhere over here (them being British and all). Hence why I think they are shit.

- Sex Pistols were popular yes, but so was Bob Marley, and I wouldn't call his music Pop. He was reggae, the Sex Pistols were punk, don't call them pop, please. Calling good bands Pop, Science help me, why not just stab with a real dagger instead of a metaphorical one.

- They suck. Is that good enough for you?

[Jordan]

If Cobain was still alive he would not be as popular as it is. He was not all that special.

People always say this, but I fail to see the big point. The same can be said for any one killed, including John Lennon, whose music sucked btw(solo career). First off, Kurt Cobain was larger than life. Nirvana was the undisputed 'biggest band'. They came they conquered and they left. People weren't done with them and the void Kurt's death left behind has yet to be filled, face it rock has not had a superstar since him.

Bob marley and Sex Pistols both left their influences on Pop Culture. People who can't name a single song from either still know their name. POPULAR!

You could never understand Nirvana since you were about 3 years old when they exploded. I was consious when Nevermind came to existence, I saw through my older teenage sister how their style influenced the way people dressed and thought. Light faded ripped jeans, boots, plaid jackets, etc.. I also remember at his death, about 45 people from my school went to a field and smoked a joint in his honor, a few girls were even crying. You dont' get that kind of outpour from bands today. Ya you can say they sucked but they are not overated and they were the biggest act in rock during the 90s and even now nobody has surpassed them.

There was no internet back then and it was tougher to find good music, being a 10 year old kid at the time I had no money and couldn't go to shows so whatever I heard on the radio and saw on MTV was what i had to live with. BON JOVI, GNR, POISON, etc.. they are the bands are remember prior to Nirvana. I remember Whitney Houston, Vanilla Ice, Mc Hammer, Madonna, etc.. Pixies, the Smiths were never played on the radio or showed on MTV in the early 90s. Nirvana was a breath of fresh air.

This post has been edited by Jordan: 29 January 2007 - 02:31 PM

[Heccubus]

face it rock has not had a superstar since him.

*cough*
Trent Reznor
Rob Zombie
Chris Cornell
Zack De La Rocha (dude's solo album STILL hasn't come out, and people are still wetting themselves with anticipation over it)
Maynard James Keenan
Julian Casablancas
Pete Doherty (all the drugs, strange behaviour, and influencial fashion sense, plus a lot more jail time)
Fred Durst (unfortunately)
etc
etc
etc
*/cough*

I mean, come on. There have been TONS of outlandish, over-the-top rock stars that have become household names. Doherty's music doesn't even get played on the radio much and he's on the cover of no less than a dozen music magazines and tabloids constantly.

[Jordan]

Ya those guys are all big, but they are not seen as mega stars. It's like comparing the beatles with any of their contemporaries. When you extract the sound of a generation, Nirvana was that sound. The whole self loathing generation x thing is pinned to that kind of music. The whole 'seattle' scene changed music. They may not be original, but few are. They did however bring it too the masses. Kurt Cobains star power, something he hated and was sincere about, has not been matched by any of the guys in your list.


I'm not saying Nirvana was the only band worth listening too or the only band since then getting fame, I'm saying they were the biggest band in the world that impacted music and fashion and social groups. And I have yet to see a rock act since them do the same thing. Radiohead, Oasis, etc.. are all huge. Oasis never really reached North America, however. Nobody is dressing up like Thom Yorke and he certainly doesn't get much coverage from reporters.

When you think of the 90s, for those who were born in the early 80s, most people remember Nirvana.

PS- Cobain got the same attention as Doherty and his music was played on the radio. People regarded them as saviours of radio play. Something Kurt was uncomfortable about, but there you have it. On interviewer in France started off by saying " i just want to thank you guys for saving rock".

Be honest, nobody is getting that kind of attention or admiration.

This post has been edited by Jordan: 29 January 2007 - 07:24 PM

[J m HofMarN]

I have to say, MCR is looking very much like the next big thing in rock, and Gerard Way seemed well on his way to following the self destructiv tradition of Curt Cobain for a time.

[Heccubus]

That notion scares the shit out of me.