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Why legalize assault weapons?

#286 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 06 April 2010 - 11:50 PM

I shall definately look it up. I'm sure you've seen All The King's Men, the allegorical Huey Long story, but in that vein I can do you the service of encouraging you never to buy Spike Lee's Huey Newton biopic. I was really looking forward to a sixties/seventies period piece on the life of Huey Newton and the Panther movement, but instead its just one guy jabbering off Newton's biography and trying to be artsy.

Of course, my views and experiences with the filmography of Spike Lee are totally inconsequential to any discussion of Spike Lee films, so watch it if you want.

This post has been edited by J m HofMarN: 07 April 2010 - 12:05 AM

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#287 User is offline   Deucaon Icon

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 04:02 AM

View Postcivilian_number_two, on 07 April 2010 - 02:27 PM, said:

Deuc: not one of your examples is of some kind of grass-roots populist rebellion. All are organized events involving armies. The exchange of political power was in every one of those cases engineered at a political level. The "Iranian Revolution" was a period of street fighting followint the country's leader simply abandoning his country afetr some public protests. After the brief period of violence, an ELECTION was held and a new guy came in. That is not the same as a coup. The military wasn't even defeated, though it was destabilized enough for Iraq to try to destroy it (and it failed). Even Britain granting independence to much of Ireland was a political concession that came as a result of political pressures and the trouble of concurrent struggles, a home war and an international war. India gained its independence too after a Britain weakened by an international war just couldn't afford to rule it. In none of your examples, and in none that I can think of, did the people didn't just step out of their homes with their assault rifles and take down the government. So, I am not saying the ideal of protecting one's self from tyranny is a bad one, it's just not the reason for soccer moms to keep loaded pistols at toddler-level. Again: firearm education. Again: Canada smarter, fewer infant handgun deaths. Boo, NRA, for not promoting firearm education as strongly as it promotes redneck white pride.

A coup followed by an election doesn't neglect the fact that political power was quickly seized and the former regime thrown out and replaced. In Romania and Nepal they used assault rifles. In the rest they used what they could find. Regardless: guns, or the threat of armed violence, is what coerced the government to step down or what overthrew the government outright. These are just a few examples, though. There's others, I'm sure, all over Asia, Africa, South/Central America and Europe. And those were examples of popular uprisings, not necessarily armed uprisings.

View Postcivilian_number_two, on 07 April 2010 - 02:27 PM, said:

JM: The Wind That Shakes the Barley is a fairly even-handed account of a single man's involvement in rebellion, and the gradual change in his ideals when he sees his comrades become the new animal farm. It has some overdramatized bits, and the "brother versus brother" metaphor goes a bit too far IMO, but it is a strong movie. Of course, it helps if you already think the English were bastards at that time. But if you don't, you might appreciate seeing how the Irish became bastards too. You should see this movie.

Is that that story about the two brothers sniping each other over Belfast? Man, was that a shit story.
"I felt insulted until I realized that the people trying to mock me were the same intellectual titans who claimed that people would be thrown out of skyscrapers and feudalism would be re-institutionalized if service cartels don't keep getting political favors and regulations are cut down to only a few thousand pages worth, that being able to take a walk in the park is worth driving your nation's economy into the ground, that sexual orientation is a choice that can be changed at a whim, that problems caused by having institutions can be solved by introducing more institutions or strengthening the existing ones that are causing the problems, and many more profound pearls of wisdom. I no longer feel insulted because I now feel grateful for being alive and witnessing such deep conclusions from my fellows."
-Jimmy McTavern, 1938.
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#288 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 01:13 AM

I like that you spent half of the past thread implying that everyones opinions and experiences are irrelevent, then immediately toss out a 2 sentence opinion about a film Civ reccomended as though your unwanted comments will cause some kind of horrible trollocaust. Good luck with that.

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I don't know about you but I have never advocated that homosexuals, for any reason, be cut out of their mother's womb and thrown into a bin.
- Deucaon toes a hard line on gay fetus rights.
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#289 User is offline   civilian_number_two Icon

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 11:15 PM

Deuc: guns, or the threat of violence, has toppled many governments, yes. But a bunch of rebel-flag-waving okies with assault rifles in their pickup trucks have never toppled a government ever. So, again: the idea that universal gun ownership is a defence against tyranny is just a selling point for the gun lobbies, like the image of smokers being sexy and intellectual was a selling point for the tobacco lobbies. And no, the examples you gave were not of grassroots, apolitical, civilian militias topling governments. That has never happened, anywhere, ever. Except maybe in that one Conan movie. But not in the real world, no.
"I had a lot of different ideas. At one point, Luke, Leia and Ben were all going to be little people, and we did screen tests to see if we could do that." -George Lucas, in STAR WARS: the Annotated Screenplays (p197).
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#290 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 10 April 2010 - 02:24 AM

Actually Civ, just to play deuacon's advocate: if an oily guy without a shirt, who may wield either a sword, or three swords duct taped together, comes to a town and punches a few guards, the towns people will immediately rise up and follow him to sack the castle. They're never armed with assault rifles though, and it may only work if the ruler they're overthrowing has a princess hostage or a ridiculous fantasy name. For more case studies in successful random citizen revolts, see any of Chefelf's fantasy movie reviews.

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I don't know about you but I have never advocated that homosexuals, for any reason, be cut out of their mother's womb and thrown into a bin.
- Deucaon toes a hard line on gay fetus rights.
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#291 User is offline   Deucaon Icon

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Posted 17 April 2010 - 02:45 AM

View Postcivilian_number_two, on 09 April 2010 - 02:15 PM, said:

Deuc: guns, or the threat of violence, has toppled many governments, yes. But a bunch of rebel-flag-waving okies with assault rifles in their pickup trucks have never toppled a government ever. So, again: the idea that universal gun ownership is a defence against tyranny is just a selling point for the gun lobbies, like the image of smokers being sexy and intellectual was a selling point for the tobacco lobbies. And no, the examples you gave were not of grassroots, apolitical, civilian militias topling governments. That has never happened, anywhere, ever. Except maybe in that one Conan movie. But not in the real world, no.

You're going to have to specifically point out how they're not. Also, being apolitical is irrelevant. And gun lobbies lobby the government, not civilians. The ones that lobby civilians probably don't represent weapons manufacturers which make automatic rifles.
"I felt insulted until I realized that the people trying to mock me were the same intellectual titans who claimed that people would be thrown out of skyscrapers and feudalism would be re-institutionalized if service cartels don't keep getting political favors and regulations are cut down to only a few thousand pages worth, that being able to take a walk in the park is worth driving your nation's economy into the ground, that sexual orientation is a choice that can be changed at a whim, that problems caused by having institutions can be solved by introducing more institutions or strengthening the existing ones that are causing the problems, and many more profound pearls of wisdom. I no longer feel insulted because I now feel grateful for being alive and witnessing such deep conclusions from my fellows."
-Jimmy McTavern, 1938.
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#292 User is offline   civilian_number_two Icon

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Posted 18 April 2010 - 04:36 PM

I already did point that out. Not going to do it again.
"I had a lot of different ideas. At one point, Luke, Leia and Ben were all going to be little people, and we did screen tests to see if we could do that." -George Lucas, in STAR WARS: the Annotated Screenplays (p197).
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#293 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 18 April 2010 - 09:39 PM

Why is it irrelevent if a militia is apolitical? Are you implying that a socialist/fascist/communist/libertarian militia would spontaneously overthrow the government only to NOT install their own prefered form of government? (Hint: moderate militias are, at best, a miniscule portion of the militia crowd. They mostly gravitate towards extremes of left or right)

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I don't know about you but I have never advocated that homosexuals, for any reason, be cut out of their mother's womb and thrown into a bin.
- Deucaon toes a hard line on gay fetus rights.
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#294 User is offline   bongo300 Icon

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Posted 23 April 2010 - 05:20 AM

They create more problems than they solve
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#295 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 11:55 AM

Wow someone from Australia that isn't insane... Welcome to the forums! I'm JM, the local tyrant.

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I don't know about you but I have never advocated that homosexuals, for any reason, be cut out of their mother's womb and thrown into a bin.
- Deucaon toes a hard line on gay fetus rights.
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#296 User is offline   Deucaon Icon

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Posted 26 December 2010 - 10:32 PM

I've decided that Americans (including Canadians because, let's face it, there's no difference between the two) shouldn't be armed. At all. Outlaw everything. Including kitchen utensils. I'm serious. Americans should get a whiff of what it's like being a foreigner under American occupation.
"I felt insulted until I realized that the people trying to mock me were the same intellectual titans who claimed that people would be thrown out of skyscrapers and feudalism would be re-institutionalized if service cartels don't keep getting political favors and regulations are cut down to only a few thousand pages worth, that being able to take a walk in the park is worth driving your nation's economy into the ground, that sexual orientation is a choice that can be changed at a whim, that problems caused by having institutions can be solved by introducing more institutions or strengthening the existing ones that are causing the problems, and many more profound pearls of wisdom. I no longer feel insulted because I now feel grateful for being alive and witnessing such deep conclusions from my fellows."
-Jimmy McTavern, 1938.
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#297 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 27 December 2010 - 04:18 AM

Canadians are very different from Americans, Deuacon. They all live in igloos and their conveyance is dog-powered rather than motorized. Your cultural insensitivity is amazing. Also, you made the "you're all too stupid to own guns" argument after the first time we beat down your "everyone needs an assault rifle to kill crack head zombies" argument. I can get you a link if you'd like.

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I don't know about you but I have never advocated that homosexuals, for any reason, be cut out of their mother's womb and thrown into a bin.
- Deucaon toes a hard line on gay fetus rights.
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#298 User is offline   Deucaon Icon

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Posted 27 December 2010 - 05:53 AM

View PostJ m HofMarN, on 27 December 2010 - 07:18 PM, said:

Canadians are very different from Americans, Deuacon. They all live in igloos and their conveyance is dog-powered rather than motorized. Your cultural insensitivity is amazing. Also, you made the "you're all too stupid to own guns" argument after the first time we beat down your "everyone needs an assault rifle to kill crack head zombies" argument. I can get you a link if you'd like.


That was that other guy, Jordan. I think weapons are to be used to protect yourself against the government and quasi-governments like corporations and unions and gangs and whatever. Of course, I don't like Americans. Or quasi-Americans, like Canadians. So you guys should be utterly unarmed when a SWAT member or riot officer shoves a baton up your ass. If anybody has earned that treatment, it's you guys.
"I felt insulted until I realized that the people trying to mock me were the same intellectual titans who claimed that people would be thrown out of skyscrapers and feudalism would be re-institutionalized if service cartels don't keep getting political favors and regulations are cut down to only a few thousand pages worth, that being able to take a walk in the park is worth driving your nation's economy into the ground, that sexual orientation is a choice that can be changed at a whim, that problems caused by having institutions can be solved by introducing more institutions or strengthening the existing ones that are causing the problems, and many more profound pearls of wisdom. I no longer feel insulted because I now feel grateful for being alive and witnessing such deep conclusions from my fellows."
-Jimmy McTavern, 1938.
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#299 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 27 December 2010 - 11:45 PM

Do you not realize that this is a forum, where all of your comments are archived? Jordan never argued that assault rifles were needed to kill hordes of crack head zombies wielding assault rifles in CQB. Surely you are aware that, in fact, you made that argument, or one indistinguishable from it. Surely you are also aware that it would only take an hour at best to scan the thread and discover the veracity (or lack thereof) of your previous statement. So why even say it? Also, why would the police have batons if all Americans, Canadians and, for some reason, quasi-Americans, were unarmed? Are the swat teams coming here from other countries?

UNIONS? We need assault rifles to defend against UNIONS? Are you batshit insane? Do you not know what a union is? Do you wake up every day and make up definitions for words and groups simply for the purposes of trolling?

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I don't know about you but I have never advocated that homosexuals, for any reason, be cut out of their mother's womb and thrown into a bin.
- Deucaon toes a hard line on gay fetus rights.
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#300 User is offline   J m HofMarN Icon

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Posted 28 December 2010 - 12:17 AM

By the way, since youre likely to keep arguing this point, here's your post http://www.chefelf.c...ndpost&p=187338 wherein you claim that assault rifles are needed to prevent criminals from attacking American homes.

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I don't know about you but I have never advocated that homosexuals, for any reason, be cut out of their mother's womb and thrown into a bin.
- Deucaon toes a hard line on gay fetus rights.
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