Chefelf.com Night Life: Reasons to Hate Star Wars - Chefelf.com Night Life

Well, Darth's helmet WAS on all the Lobby posters. But your right, it was usually in the background.

Just for argument's sake, did Gollum kill the good hobbit that was Smeagol?

Interesting point. From a certain point of view, I guess.
But Smeagol wasn't a good hobbit anyway...
But then again, the Anakin we've seen thus far in the prequels isn't a good man. Hmmm.

Vader was only the Big Bad in Empire - in A New Hope it was Tarkin, and in Return of the Jedi Vader wasn't always big and wasn't always bad. I don't know where people get the idea that its the story of Anakin, especially since the original title wasn't 'Star Wars' but 'The Adventures of Luke Skywalker'

Hello!

I am new here, I am not that huge Star Wars fan, but I love fantasy, and Star Wars/LOTR are only two great movie fantasy epics out there!

Now Episode 3 gets me excited, I really liked some aspects of PT, some didn`t, but I am watching ROTS clips all the time now!



Chefelf, I have seen TPM almost 2 years ago last time, but I don`t agree with much of your list!

I will get back to it after I have more free time!

This post has been edited by Lord Melkor: 11 May 2005 - 01:52 PM

It was THE RING!

Dunno if this is the place for the Nitpick stuff, but...

Related to the one where Darth was surprised by Luke being Anakin's son, well, I don't know jack 'bout Ep. 3, but if Padme were to die somehow, but give birth to children before her death, that's a reason he might find it shocking.

Lord Melkor,

Are you a kid uh... Lord? You sound like you're very young from your comments and constant replacement of periods for exclamation points.

I ask because I don't want to be too harsh to criticize a child who is just trying to play and have fun here.

That’s really great that you’re ‘new’ and ‘not that huge’ a SW fan and oddly... also want to proclaim that is the only ‘great’ fantasy epic besides LotRs.

It’s also neat that you’re watching ‘ROTS clips all the time now!’ but what’s your point?

If you’re gonna tell ‘Chefelf’ that you don’t agree with much of his list, it’s only right to actually say ‘why’ or it’s just a baseless insult -though hardly one to make an adult cry or anything.

If you don’t have the time to say ‘why’ then you shouldn’t bother to disagree with someone or tell them they’re wrong or wait to post until you do have the time.

Oh... and Chefelf....

I haven’t gone through all 13 or whatever pages of this thread (or others) so someone else may have already said this additional ‘Reason’ for why these films suck...

In all three films the Jedi take on a bad Sith in a ‘double team’ attack. Jedi Knights would not do this! (note Lord Melkor. -that’s the type of line that an exclamation point is meant for).

Jedi are clearly and blatantly modeled (read: ripped-off) from Japanese Samurai and to some extent also the legend of the Knights of the Round Table (hence the ‘round’ Jedi Master bean bag hippie loft and Anakin saying ‘Ma’ Lady’ to Padme’).

A Jedi, or Samurai, or Knight of legend (not actual middle-age knights who were actually filthy and not the least big chivalrous) would consider it a disgrace to double team a single opponent.

lucas shows he doesn’t even understand the Jedi he hardly created.

The first example of this would be him calling his third SW film Revenge of the Jedi and someone else having to explain to him that Jedi would never seek revenge on someone.

Now you could say -‘hey... they happen upon a bad guy and there happens to be two of them and one bad guy. What do you expect them to do flip a coin (or a 6-sided die right Chefelf hehe) to decide who gets to fight him?’

And I’d say... ‘Yes. Basically.’
But really I’d say the senior Jedi should take the bad guy on meaning Qui-Gon tells Obi-Wan to go fight sumthin’ else while he takes on Maul Epi. I and Obi-Wan sends Anakin out to do something else when they happen upon Dooku. I won’t give away Epi. III events.

Alinktothepast,

(can't people just make up names for their names? Why do people use phrases?)

Anyway...

"-Related to the one where Darth was surprised by Luke being Anakin's son, well, I don't know jack 'bout Ep. 3, but if Padme were to die somehow, but give birth to children before her death, that's a reason he might find it shocking.-"

Chefelf addressed that point in his own points. Go look at it again. It's not simply that he didn't know he had a kid so it should be a surprise....
it's that Vader was after 'Luke Skywalker' before this and it's pretty dumb for Vader not to have thunk...
'Gee... this kid's got MY last name?'

Now that's absurd. If a badass Sith comes out of nowhere, do you really think that an old guy would say, 'No, go sit in the corner and I'll fight him'? Of course not. And if the Sith go the chance, he would kill the non-fighting opponent. The point is, you're saying that the Jedi are idiots. You're saying that if they had the advantage, they wouldn't use it to end thier most feared opponents, whose only goal is power at the cost of innocient lives, which they are trying to save. Sorry, but no.

This post has been edited by floppydisk: 13 May 2005 - 06:37 PM

The ring being the Power of the ring. I'd counter that with Annie it was the Power of the Force.
("You have not yet discovered the Power of the Dark Side.")

Ben might've explained that, but he was wanting to train Luke in the force. So let's not scare off our New Hope with too much dark force talk.

floppydisk wrote -

"-Now that's absurd. If a badass Sith comes out of nowhere, do you really think that an old guy would say, 'No, go sit in the corner and I'll fight him'? Of course not.-"

Listen to your argument.... an 'old guy'?
You're exagerating to make your weak point.

the 'old guy' was a Jedi MASTER. And I didn't say he should have said 'go sit in a corner'.
You're right it was stupid, but YOU said it.

I would have written it so that Obi-Wan (who was still technically not even a Jedi yet) would have had other trouble to deal with -like more of those battle droids to not totally rewrite the awful story.

Then YEAH... his MASTER tells him to deal with that crap while he takes on this Sith.

Double teaming good guys on one bad guy is very un-Jedi. I'm sorry that you don't see that but then neither did lucas so there's two of you at least who don't understand what a Knight of honor would do.

"-And if the Sith go the chance, he would kill the non-fighting opponent.-"

Dude... I didn't say Obi-Wan should put his lightsaber away and let Maul get near him and then kill him.

Remember what happened. They came after Maul. They both followed him back into onther rooms.

It was probably someone other than lucas who suggested those stupid timed barriers that were used to actually make it a one on one battle between Maul and QuiGon while Obi-Wan HAD to wait and do nothing.

"-The point is, you're saying that the Jedi are idiots.-"

lucas has done MORE than enough to show them as idiots. I'm talking about the original intent of what a Jedi was meant to be. A Samurai. An Arthurian Knight.

AS I SAID.

Just because you didn't understand me doesn't mean that I intended to make the Jedi look like idiots.
Double teaming them make them look like wimps who need their buddies to help them fight a guy. Esp. a Jedi Master needing help.

Qui-Gon could have said something like 'you'll only get in my way' if Obi-Wan wanted to jump into the fight too. That would have made sense so that Qui-Gon doesn't have to worry about Obi-Wan taking a blade to the throat from Maul OR himself.

Hell in grade school kids would get pissed if a third guy jumped into a fist fight between two dudes 'cuz even children know it's 'cheating' 'unfair' 'weak'.

"-You're saying that if they had the advantage, they wouldn't use it to end thier most feared opponents, whose only goal is power at the cost of innocient lives, which they are trying to save. Sorry, but no.-"

You should be sorry because you don't know what you're talking about. Yes.... Jedi DO NOT use any means they can to win a battle. That's the Sith that cheat or do anything to win.

And yeah... that does actually make them win going by Epi. III but only because lucas ignored the powers the Force is suppose to give Jedi.

In real life a soldier's goal on either 'side' is to win. Do whatever to win 'cuz your side's right so it's 'just' to do anything.

In this mythological fantasy Jedi are idealized warriors. lucas TOTALLY screws all the Jedi rules up esp. in Epi. III.

Azryan.

Obi-Wan and Anakin didn't double up on Dooku - they may have tag-teamed, but the two of them didn't fight him together.

Maul was the attacker in Ep I... when you go to attack someone you have all sorts of opportunities to fight honourably, but when someone turns up while you have a whole lot of non-force-wielding people running around the Jedi should go to the head of the column and hold him off, they can get around to solo fighting honour afterwards.

Also - its hard to say the Jedi weren't fighting fairly when for all that they showed up with better odds they still got their butts kicked.

The double-team of master and apprentice makes perfect sense to me... but thats just me.

"You're right it was stupid, but YOU said it."
Check your own words azryan. And don't bash the other guy about being new when you showed up less than a day ago.

Ah, I see... I haven't seen much of Star Wars in a very long time. :x

Also, A Link to the Past is the first nickname I had on the first forum I went to, so I stick with it. It's my GFAQs name, Wikipedia name, and, well, Chefelf name.

Mnesymone,

“-Obi-Wan and Anakin didn't double up on Dooku - they may have tag-teamed, but the two of them didn't fight him together.-“

Tag-team vs. one man IS a double team. And since they didn’t actually ‘tag’ double team IS the more accurate phrase.

Yes it’s not ‘exactly’ at the same time but you see two boxers tag team vs. another guy and call it fair?
No.
And that’s why you don’t ever see that.

“-Check your own words azryan. And don't bash the other guy about being new when you showed up less than a day ago.-“

I don’t need to check my words ‘cuz I knew what I wrote and why when I wrote it. I’ll explain it for you though ‘cuz you have a problem with it. I don’t mind explaining things.

Floppydisk wrote -"-Now that's absurd.-“

I replied with -“You're right it was stupid, but YOU said it.-“

Absurd. Stupid. I consider them similar enough. Maybe you don’t but I won’t change my mind that I feel they’re basically the same.

If it makes you feel better you can pretend I wrote ‘absurd’ instead of ‘stupid’ in my reply and please ALSO consider that it was floppy calling my thoughts ‘absurd’ in the first place yet he invented his own version of what I said to make his case.

That’s both absurd and stupid but I’d call it redundant to say both.

Back to your comments....

Tag-team. Double team.You seem to be nitpicking words that are for all intents and purposes the SAME?
I don’t dig that.

“-Maul was the attacker in Ep I... when you go to attack someone you have all sorts of opportunities to fight honourably, but when someone turns up while you have a whole lot of non-force-wielding people running around the Jedi should go to the head of the column and hold him off, they can get around to solo fighting honour afterwards.-“

I don’t get your point - “when someone turns up while you have a whole lot of non-force-wielding people running around the Jedi-”?

Who are you talking about?
I don’t get that whole confused sentence. Sorry but it’s a mess.

“-Also - its hard to say the Jedi weren't fighting fairly when for all that they showed up with better odds they still got their butts kicked.-“

Again that sentence hardly even makes sense. I don’t understand you. Can you try to write clearer next time?

From what I can pick out of it you aren’t saying anything specific to ‘Jedi double teaming Maul’ so I have no idea how to reply to whatever your counterpoint meant to be.

“-The double-team of master and apprentice makes perfect sense to me... but thats just me.-“

You just said it WASN’T double teaming? Yeesh. Why pretent to ‘correct’ me when you are just going to admit I’m right later on? I’m replying to your comments one by one so you’re just wasting my time to do that.

"-And don't bash the other guy about being new when you showed up less than a day ago.-"

Who did I bash about being new?

This post has been edited by azryan: 13 May 2005 - 10:47 PM

Ofcourse, the danger to any Jedi is the Dark side of the force. Agression, anger lead to it. And once your in it, it insnares you, much like once you hold the ring, it corrupts you. Yoda tries to make this clear to Luke in the Cave scene in ESB.

I don't know about that. If not for being his son, why is Vader so obsessed with finding Luke?